You can never truly pheno hunt fems. They are very similar especially after selfing more than once.
All genetic diversity would be bottlenecked to an unthinkable disgusting end to such an amazing plant.
We wouldn’t have the strains of today without male female breeding and we wouldn’t have the strains in our future without male female breeding.
If you s1 a clone only your still not going to get that clone only just something similar.
Yeah sure fems are fine as a last attempt to preserve something, or like was said earlier for someone with low plant counts that can’t waste the space on males or someone that is inexperienced and has trouble identifying males properly or in time.
They both have their uses but overall fems are not something for serious breeding.
Yes, but that is even harder than reversing a female to make pollen !
Fairly certain hybrid vigor goes out the window when working with only fems. On top of what budderton said about not being able to really make an inbred feminized line, really. What’s your real reason for wanting to use fems only? Less soil and space? I don’t know, to each their own but I like regs all day
Fems aren’t all S1s, they can be crosses, and they can show huge variation. Make an S1 of an F1 hybrid and the results are basically female F2s of the plant crossed with itself! Bottlenecking is no more severe than regular m/f, it just depends what you do. S1s are only all similar if you reverse a true breeding plant, i’ve made S1s of Chem D x Bubba Kush and you get lots of F2 style variation.
Most people who are deep into the science of breeding cannabis will advocate using fems… and if you really want to know what a plant is like, if you want to ‘unpack’ the genetics, then the best possible thing you can do is make S1s and grow them out.
VG
Absolutely not how that works lol
Pretty sure I’ve already read that kind of discussion 
https://overgrow.com/search?q=breeding%20fems
Breeding with male is cheaper (no STS, likely more beans per watts)
Hybrid vigor is EXACTLY the same as m/f. so yes if you Make S1s then that is inbreeding and will reduce vigor just as inbreeding a regular line will… and if you cross two female plants you get just the same hybrid vigor.
I never said that i wanted to use fems only, i just said that scientifically it is better.
VG
Hmmm, have you factored in the extra soil and light that you use to raise the males?
I’d appreciate resources, if you can. This is something I just haven’t seen or agree with. What’s better about it? Feels like you’re saying it’s the same but different.
an S1 is a plant crossed with itself and you get the same kind of genetic segregation as you would by crossing two plants together, except that the two plants are the same rather than similar. This teaches you so much about that plant .
or if i’m wrong then explain why please.
VG
I think fems have their uses… good for people who can’t be bothered hunting males vs females, first off, and digging deeply into the genetics of a single plant by selfing it 5-6 times is indeed a great technique for really learning that one plant, especially if you’re properly keeping track of every line and expression. Taking it a bit further, you can also use those for inbred lines to recreate the original mother in a RIL, or crossing with other inbred lines to create true F1 hybrids. I also think maybe there’s something to the idea that most of the time, unless there’s been a fair amount of work done to pin down a plant that’s hard to reverse, fems have more of a tendency to herm. I’ve literally never had a plant that wasn’t from a fem seed show any herm parts, whereas many of the ones from fem seeds have. I’m also not a perfect grower, and my plants are probably under some stress a fair amount of the time. 
It’s also not a large-scale test, but I think the results kinda speak for themselves.
Depends what you mean by F1 hybrid. 
“True” F1 hybrids made by crossing two IBLs will be heterozygous but homogeneous, i.e. any two crossed together will yield the same results - as would a S1. Of course, most of the cannabis breeding world doesn’t give a (#&$ about “true” F1 hybrids and just crosses polyhybrids with polyhybrids. It’s the difference between breeding show dogs and breeding mutts, no offense - the mutts are wonderful dogs and a lot of us love them, but when you start talking breeding and you’re digging into statistics, a distinction has to be made.
Less intersex issues
Define an f1 hybrid because taking two poly hybrids and smashing them together doesnt make a true f1. We all use the term wrong
Edit… what @Cormoran said
There would be a lot of differences and hybrid vigour if you cross 2 females yes but it you make an s1 with an f1 it would GREATLY reduce the diversity of the line and they would not be anywhere near a regular f2, Where you normally would get to see HUGE genetic variation and where you get to find a lot of the winners and stand out phenos.
With this format, you have to be 100% certain what you’re after is within the genetics you’re selfing. It is not an f2…it’s exploring the genes within one pheno. Deleterious alleles are also recessive, so you’re really increasing your chances of finding the mishaps in that genome if you stick with fems
I just thought about this to, Esko told me years ago
Like a decade that “one day they will come for our seeds”
I was like Herb?
He said “ALL of them”
Flash forward 10 years and I have seen this isn’t far off.
As far as veggies go unless you have heirlooms
You have to buy from Monsanto so to speak
I have heard, and read others out west saying the
Money is trying to corner the herb market
Trying hard to make it the same with veggies
If you want our plants you have to buy from us.
Just my opinion but another good reason to always
Have diverse healthy population of male seeds.
I go sit in the corner now lol
Intersex issues are entirely down to selection of the parents, there is NO reason why a fem plant is more likely to be intersex.
The reason why some fem seeds may have more intersex is because they have been badly selected, perhaps because an ‘easy to reverse’ plant was used to make the seeds. So whilst you may have found more intersex in fems, it is not because they are more likely in fems… just that the fem seeds were made with poor selections and so that is not a real scientific reason…
VG
I stand by what i say. An S1 is akin to an ‘F2’ of a plant crossed with itself and the genetics will segregate in just the same way… so S1s of some polyhybrid will give you a lot of variation.S1s of a ‘real’ F1 hybrid will give you less variation and S1s of a true breeding plant will give you even less variation.
VG
Ive had more herms from regular m/f plants than fems.
Sounds like you want your experience to be everyone else’s. You’ve not provided sources or intelligent arguments otherwise. Your opinion is perfectly valid but it’s just that. Regs all the way 
peace