Oh, don’t get me wrong; if Paypal is trying to claim that they’re just upholding the law by enabling sales of “grey market” stuff like this when they’re actually seizing and keeping the money, that’s a problem. I just think it’s a big mess waiting to happen and want nothing to do with it, like most of the commercial side of this business. That’s the ugly side of legalization, imo. No offense, but I tune out commercials from lawyers trying to find clients for class-action lawsuits when prescription drugs run amok are turning people’s internal organs to pudding just the same as I’d like to tune this out. 
1 Like
And of course you’re working this potential case pro bono, right? Out of the goodness of your heart without accepting a penny, even for expenses?
1 Like
I get it. But I doubt there are enough seed people with this problem to populate and justify the cost of a class action. In most cases you need to arbitrate under your contract anyway. People can envision court actions because they are on TV but can you visualize what happens in arbitration? Most people are frightened by what they can’t visualize. Parties are usual responsible for their own fees in that forum.
All of this raises an important point about cannabis enthusiasts. The herb and its proponents have been vilified for over a hundred years. Being illegal, the courts were denied to them for resolving disputes. Over the past 10 years laws legalizing what was once a crime have been enacted but knowing it and using the courts for disputes to enforce rights is foreign. I call it a form of PTSD. This is especially true for seeds because with the right to cultivate comes the right to obtain all resources to exercise that right. The right to cultivate has expanded to patients, commercial medical growers and commercial recreational growers and unlicesed individuals. When it comes to seed sales in Michigan the very first seed banks I was aware of were known as Compassionate Seed companies. Odd name. To provide the resource to grow medicine.
4 Likes
I would like to say I have known @Pasquale for several years now from a different site.
He has been helpful at every turn.
He always answered peoples questions never asking for anything in return.
He is a friend first and a lawyer second.
While I am not a big fan of lawyers in general, this dude has been nothing but cool to me.
We could all use some legal advice concerning cannabis now and then.
He has provided that on numerous occasions, and has been extremely helpful for me let alone others.
I personally invited him here originally to share his knowledge of exactly how seeds are legal among other things.
Folks around here were going back and forth.
@Pasquale and I have been discussing this topic at another site for over a year now.
He provided the link to the webinar I posted here.
I am only suggesting you folks give this guy a chance to show what he is about before you run him outta Dodge city here… 
7 Likes
That may be true as far as your relationship with him, but that is exactly the opposite of how he came at OG.
@Pasquale might have a better experience if he reads and participates in other threads before trying to drum up business for himself. Make yourself known, liked, and trusted (or at least known & trusted) before trying to turn a profit on the folks here. It’s the same with the people coming here to get free seeds…introduce yourself, participate, and the trust (and seeds) will come without hardly asking.
Frankly, I’m not even sure it’s kosher to try to drum up business here without being a site supporter. Seed banks and breeders have to be supporters before they can advertise…seems like attorneys, accountants, and others offering services should do the same. But that’s for folk like @LemonadeJoe to decide.
1 Like
Perhaps the list mom should change the thread topic away from security and legal?
I wanted to share this post with anyone that has suffered confiscation of account money by PaPal for using their platform by selling any non THC cannabis derived product. This would include seeds and CBD oil containing less than .3% THC by weight. Any product covered by the DEA formal opinion known as Shane Pennington letter.
PayPal is a licensed Money Transmitter in 49 of 50 states. It is not a bank but in every state their business is overseen by a state administrator. In Michigan, that administrator is the Department of Insurance and Financial Services. Their assigned license number is MT0015645. In Michigan you can file a complaint at Filing a Complaint With DIFS
Not only am I filing a suit and or arbitration against against PayPal for my seed bank client but I am also proceeding with a complaint against Pay Pal’s licensure.
You do not need an attorney to do so and I would be happy to share my complaint with anyone to serve as a guide. I will be happy to answer any questions. Don’t let cynicism rule your view of legal process.
4 Likes
PayPal is a scam anyway.
They now require you to provide a social security number to simply pay an invoice. Say you wana split the bill at dinner…well PayPal is gunna need your social security number, home address and 3 verifying documents…what BS! Nasdaq should delist them!! (Probably do them a favor…
)
1 Like
Here we go…
So its clear PayPal is full of shit. PLUS the are violating the rights of US citizens and directly going against federal law by confiscating funds related to seeds.
So PayPal seems to be giving the canna industry a hard time. Nasdaq delists PayPal and the political climate opens up so that numerous cannabis companies can go public. Nasdaq opens up a new gross commodities sector including canna products, and any vertically oriented businesses. How does Nasdaq like a company that gives away $1000 dollar grow light, pays the vendor, and then writes a bond sold on the market for the sale price? Does that sound like a well preforming stock…Uuuum YES! Does that sound like a booming market sector… YES!!!
1 Like
I would not do any canna-related business (legal or not) on PayPal. The amount of sketchy shit I’ve heard, seen, and experienced from PayPal is ridiculous. LEGIT, legal (non canna) businesses have even had their accounts/funds blocked or held for 100k+. The onus then is on your to prove to PayPal that you are running a legitimate business (paper work, tax documents, etc.), but ultimately the decision is then left in Paypal’s hands.
On top of that, even if it is a legal (CBD) business - CBD is still against Paypal’s policy.
Imo. don’t use PayPal. If you have too, keep funds in PayPal to a minimum and withdraw often. And be prepared to have them locked at any time.
3 Likes
About 8-10 years ago I had a flurry of fraudulent activity in my account. After PP sorted everything out, I ended up with almost $1k in my account that was not mine. I told them repeatedly. They did not seem to care. After about a year I spent the money …
I don’t use them anymore if at all possible, as I don’t trust a company like that with my money.
This may be the case but I just had customs confiscate a ton of seeds and the letter in side stated Cannabis illegal !
Some get throu and some don’t I believe it depends on the country of origin
1 Like
Actually all of Paypal’s business - being a private company they make their own rules and allowing CBD is unfortunately not one of them. 
Seeds are legal in all 50 States of the U.S because they do not contain THC… If shipping from or to the U.S- all you have to do is put a note in the box that States ’ seeds containing less than .03%THC ARE LEGAL to ship per. U.S DEA January 2022’.
OR- ‘for souvenir purposes only, Not intended for germination’.
Either way, they can’t confiscate of you can sue/charge them for the lost seeds… in the U.S anyway… referring to post office-- not PayPal
2 Likes
The usps policy is that you must have a license to sell hemp products otherwise they are considered contraband still. All seeds going threw the mail from outside the country must have a phyto sanitary certificate or they can be thrown in the trash. All living plants crossing states lines must also be accompanied by a certificate.
3 Likes
But they have no way of knowing if you are selling or gifting/donating. Can always include a note that it is a gift/donation…
Clones are not the same as seeds, as they do contain THC…Like sending weed/hash/edibles…still a HUGE no-no-- IF you gt aught… but they just confiscate- unless there are a lot of them.
2 Likes
The usps says you must be licensed to grow hemp products to ship them , they way it is written it won’t matter if they are a gift or purchased item they are legally able to discard them because it is a violation of there policies.
There are many things that are federally legal that you can not ship threw standard mail services.
1 Like
Sure they can confiscate your seeds. You are correct that now seeds are not illegal in the USA, however importing them across the border without the correct paperwork is against the Department of Agricultures rules. It’s the DOA that is responsible for the confiscation, which is why nobody ever get’s the cops knocking on their door over importation of seeds. Instead they receive their package with a letter from the DOA stating their seeds have been confiscated for lack of correct paperwork showing testing for pesticides and such. Unfortunately a note in the package does not cover the legal requirements for entry. These are 2 separate issues. You will not get in trouble by the DEA but still have to follow the rules of the DOA.
4 Likes
I read this topic until now and Paypal may stink for business but for personal use it is a charm, sure It is connected to my bank account and from there they have everything they need to know me.
I think it is legit for them to deny weed related business as long as weed remain illegal in most parts of the world.
For me Paypal is nice, I even can get payments from costumers and no trouble at all but I don’t use much the PayPal, every now and then when I am about to spend some online money, I just charge my account and buy what I was intended to.
During pandemic I was forced to use the UberEats service and the last time I placed an order those bitches take my dinner home.
Have you ever tried to contact UberEats?
In Portugal there are no contacts for them, no costumer service, nothing. And they are based in north Europe, so Paypal payed me back my stolen meal and I was very happy with it.
That is why in Europe a web site with paypal is usually seen as a safe place to buy.
But seed banks don’t have that option so… Wire transfer, and I don’t like to do those wire transfers but what to do?
Their house, their rules.
2 Likes
Back to PayPal. PayPal is licensed in 49 of 50 states as a Money Transmitter. In most places that is defined as an individual that acts as the Agent for a payee. Like the check cashing service at the liquor store. Need a license to make sure you handle other people’s money fairly. Anybody that uses their service to receive money is a payee. What PayPal does with its surprise takings is what is best described as dry gulching not agency. Agents always have a higher duty to their payees than a dry gulcher.