Yes, feral would prob be the correct term with what I was talking about. Feral/naturalized in a certain area can get different regional tastes and traits, as long as people aren’t introducing new genetics. Even if it’s just a lazy grower that allowed natural selection take over and open pollinate generation after generation. Pretty soon all the plants will be more adapted to the location, and there will be more uniformity from one generation to the next.
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Yea, I think you’re right. I would say that in part, you can augment this by not doing 1:1 breeding (ie 1 male to 1 female). Given the legal difficult of growing a huge field, and restricted numbers of plants, 1:1 bottlenecks too fast for hobby breeders. Gotta keep your options open for longer.
There’s only so much you can do as a hobby without paying out the ass. But as long as you’re happy with what you’re growing and enjoying the process… it’s all good.
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Just like most of the community, I dislike the practice of pollen chuckers (not true breeders) that just take the latest hits, cross them them, and just sell the seeds without testing and working the “breed”. If people know what they’re really getting and are ok with pheno hunting and gambling based on the parentage, then great. but to sell a pack labeled with a name of its own (disclosing lineage or not), and have nearly none of the seeds come out resembling each other or either parent, that’s just greedy and amateur. I see the allure and fun of hobby “breeding”. I do want to make my own crosses out of the strains I grow, but I’ll be giving/trading seeds away, and disclosing the lineage as best as I can. But I also catch myself playing the name game, like I want to make a mix of (God bud x Critical mass) x (lavender x purple kush) and call it “God’s giant pillow” Or something like that lol. See, it’s a slippery slope, I might just be another one of the fools making mutts and throwing them out to the streets to find a good home.
Horrible comparison at the end, that felt wrong right after I hit post. I work in a pet store and people who breed dogs purely for profit and dispose of them are absolutely horrible. But like I said, find them good homes!
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Where can I get Bodhi seeds except Seedsman? I’m in Cali…
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You can try great lakes genetics, or james bean too.
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Yes cannabis is an obligate outcrossing species.
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Agreed. They’ll readily self seed but it’s not ideal. In nature, most females are pollinated as soon as they push a pistil out. Cannabis is always ready to adapt haha. Even the selfed plants which in theory should be all female, produce a few males.
The adaptation of Cannabis is really extraordinary. Sure, they’ll open pollinate, but the female flowers also usually produce a few stamens…just in case lol. I honestly can’t think of a hardier species.
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Maybe kudzu. 
(or thistle in CO)
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Or the dandelions in my front yard. F**ken Bastards. Lol
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They’re real bastards. Been trying to whip my yard into shape. I mean, there’s herbicides but they kill the clover (and I like the clover). I removed several hundred this year by hand on my little 2500 sq ft yard.
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I can not get rid of them. Tried everything. Now, I just mow my grass twice a week. Lol
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Gotta get the taproot out and grow the thickest lawn possible to discourage next year’s seeds.
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I have one of those Weed Dragon torches that takes 3 seconds to kill a 6 inch tall weed. It will kill the weeds around trees and not hurt one that’s more than a few inches thick. Works great in the gravel or mulch too. If you’re worried about fire spreading, you can wet the area down or even use it right after it rains.
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I think bottom line is:
Having taken more than my share of genetics back in school…I learned from the get-go breeding is dynamic…It’s like trying to stack marbles!
Fine, you can create an IBL strain by taking it out 10 generations…but as soon as you outcross it. Most of those marbles will have moved and created ambiguity once again…
Unless there is one specific trait that you want to impart onto a new strain…you’ve got yourself a brand new can of worms…
Breeding is a combination of documentation, persistence, observation, sampling…and hoping for those Hail Mary “Black Swan” events…
Look at Doug’s Varin, and Black Beauty…the so called Elite THCV strain; well integrated into these genes …hermie tendencies…
So frankly I’m slowly getting to the point…What does it take to create something genuinely “new”…?
Well…a heck of a lot more patience than I have considering the quality of what is already out there for photoperiods.
Perhaps that’s why I see the new frontier of commercial breeding as being in the Autoflower market…to cater to a vast world where quality cannabis simply cant be grown due climate/conditions.
Cheers
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they probably will be just due to how quick it is to breed, I honestly can’t wait to see autoflowers in 5-10
years once they’re able to hold genetics in a library with tissue culture it’s gonna be incredible
For something truly new it would need to be a true F1 hybrid…I think you would need to back cross at least 6 gens to truly select for homozygous traits. Tony’s GG4 RIL did this
This is why I am interested in maybe trying to take an S1 to an S4 if I can select the shit out and only keep the best out of 100 solo cups it would be far easier to make a true breeding homozygous plant in a year than a decade even if 99/100 plants are shit if I can use that 1 as a mother for a hybrid I think it would be a killer hybrid… has anyone here tried going past an S2?
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WHF
I would be interested in following your multi- generational self experiments…for sure.
I guess one has to ask themself…What’s the objective?
To have found a plant worthy of selfing to begin with a grower would have more than likely already pinned down a good 5 or 6 traits…
- potency, terpenes, cannabinoid profile, structure, inter-nodal spacing, calyx-leaf ratio, mold tolerance, flowering period…Etc
Hypothetically speaking…as a grower…lets say you’ve nailed these above traits down to your satisfaction…(many growers will have claimed to have created such strains)…
Is there a need to further self such a plant for breeding purposes…or would it be simply to replicate at that point?
Cheers
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Hopefully I can try it soon i’m working on a Greenhouse so i’ll definitely have some space to test em if I get some fem seeds within a few months 
I kinda wanna make my own tools to build my race car something truly unique not just someone elses work but my own selection at least eventually, but also if I manage to get it to that point I know I would be able to have a seed form of a select pheno with all the traits I want and it would breed true if I ever lost a clone I would just need to pop seeds I see countless breeders losing awesome phenos over the years…
Let’s say I cross a S4 to a land race I can actively see the traits in the hybrid that I already liked and have a bit more control than at an S1 point which would be only 75% homozygous whereas the S4 will be 96% +
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WHF
You’re a far more patient man than I…not to mention, probably a heck of a lot younger. (I simply havent the time)
Reminds me of the stories of “stitch” (I believe was the breeders name)…This breeder, claims that his strains are not Autoflower…What he has done, to my understanding, is spent years crossing plants of early flowering varieties to create early flowering plants…that he claims there are no Rudy genes in his plants.
The man has the patience of a Saint in my books…He has basically taken it upon himself to mimic nature…taken years to create something similar to what Darwin has already explained to us through Natural Selection and Evolution…
Myself, perhaps I’m a less of a purist… preferring to upgrade on work that has already been done…(Are Bodhi or any other breeders we truly respect much different?) Let say Stitch took a minimum of 10 generations to create these fast flowering plants…(I’m guessing this is an extremely conservative number)…Would it not have just been better to start with Ruderalis and build 10 generations of quality genetics on top of that with what has already been established…
It’s much like technological advancement IMO, with each new generation of technology build upon the transistors and semi conductors or the generation before…
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I definitely am a youngin 
That’s pretty impressive work never heard about him. if bred out I think the usefulness of perhaps going down 10 generations of that instead of a ruderalis would be to have genes that can express the traits you desire “fast flowering” without having to bottleneck yourself with a ruderalis you can cross that with a ruderalis and maybe find something even more special by having that genetic pool expanded it allows for more diversity and more interesting progeny… I remember a while back everything was crossed to Lowryder by having that bottleneck it might’ve allowed autos to be made faster than 10 gens but it made shitty crosses
imo it’s like sure you can use an elite cultivar it will jump start you ahead & you can find awesome stuff it’s like a short cut but you limit yourself to already selected stuff it’s like Cookies is great you can cross it and get quality but you’re gonna get herms. But if they had worked the parents to full ibl’s you could potentially have a extremely vigorous hybrid & since you worked the line you know they won’t herm
by making your own line working it out and selecting the best traits you can find everything that elite has & maybe slightly better structure or smell.
Plenty of legit breeders out there! 99.9% of growing issues are the result of the “FARMER” and not the seed but there are def some some strains that Herm more then others. I don’t remember what site but dudes description said plants all hermed after f70!!? LMAO it was $400/pack also. Some bs Afghan project or some bs.see I don’t get it because I run ALL MY STRAINS under every high stress condition I can throw at them and of that happens then that project is tossed! Now my Flamethrower OG(Cookies X (Soma NYCD X Fire OG) was worked for almost 8 yrs and I only worked that one strain that entire time. I THINK BECAUSE OF GG some peeps think oh hey well that was started with a Herm so fuck it!?? People DO NOT UNDERSTAND what goes into making a strain let alone growing properly!! I def don’t believe in packs going for 100s of dollars!! It’s funny to read DIFFRENT forums though and see peeps THINK THEY KNOW is going on with whatever breeders, I mean some are shady but a shit ton put a shit ton of work, energy, effort into bringing those beans to market. PEOPLE are just fucking completely WHACK!
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