If you figure in how much you get quantity wise and the gas and heart ach from buying the bull sht and having to go back to town you really save cash and time just buying the sunshine first 
for real!
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I force flower here at 42.5 north. My outdoor season ends mid October an this particular Oaxaca pheno doesnāt start flowering til early/ mid September or so. Some other phenos would finish end of November/ early December with something decent to pick by the 20th of November or so. This one would go til mid December/Christmas for the late one.
Yes. Stem resin on anything an eighth inch in diameter or so. Sometimes even quarter inch stalks have resin. The whole plant looks silver/ white in person.
These are actually offspring of Old Silversides x regular males, 3rd generation. Iām not sure I need to do another round of breeding. I will, but I like it now, just as is.
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Itās not so bad when the wood is broken downā¦its the big chunks of bark and the actual sticks that swipe the N. That crap on top in your pic. The whole bag looks like that?
@LoveDaAutos Iām still figuring out/ may have figured out Panama Red. Iāve grown the Ace version, SnowHigh version, and 71 Panama Red.
The Ace Panama has a contaminated line in it, and unfortunately the line has been bred too far towards that Contamination, imo. Boring high. 
The SnowHigh Double Panama also uses a contaminated line from Breeders Choice, collected in the early 2000ās I think, but itās mixed with the 74 Red Cross Panama, the only pure Panama Red out there. I grew this one for seed. Flowering time seeded was 15 weeks. One grow seedless also had 15 week plants.
The 71 Panama Red is also " contaminated", yet I think itās the version people remember smoking, and the version that was written and sung about. I havenāt smoked or grown the 74 Panama yet for comparison sake.
Basically The famous panama red was a hybrid. Different companies have bred more or less towards the Indica used in its creation. Some companies have used a version with true contamination in itā¦a second Indica. In order of more Indica influence, to less influenceā¦
Ace seeds 8-10 weeks
Cannabiogen 10-14 weeks
SnowHigh Double Panama 15 weeks
Hippie Cannabis Genetics 71 Panama. The original hybrid. 18-20 weeks
74 Red Cross Panama. The original lowland Panama Red landrace, Up to 26 weeks flowering.
There are pics of SnowHigh Panama in part 1 of this thread.
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Oaxaca.
Old Silversides
Old Silversides 2.0
Old Silversides 3.0
2.0Screenshot_20230816_062406_Gallery|225x500 3.0 !
Screenshot_20230815_060018_Gallery|690x310
You can see this yearās red stem 3 sisters is the same pheno pictured in Old Silversides 2.0 above. Itās putting on more meat, and some stem resin, though I will try one more round breeding this years siblings to see if I canāt get thicker resin on the stems.
Oh. And there are no hermie flowersš
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Wow Iām such a noob! Thanks for that information @Upstate . With such a small area in which to grow. Is the SnowHigh version that much better then the Ace version to justify doubling the flowering cycle?
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Thank you so much for that.
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Absolutely Gorgeous buds on the 3.0, it looks like a really wild plant. The thin yellowing leaves almost make it look like thorns from a distance. Thereās a lot of color in it too. Bravo. 
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Iām glad you asked this question @LoveDaAutos
Iām growing 6 Ace Panamas right now and was also wondering the difference between the breeders.
My father in-law was stationed in Panama in the late 70ās for jungle training and he got to experience some of the local weed. He said the weed was literally red and very good.
Thank you @Upstate for the education on the different examples available. I would also like to know if itās worth pursuing the longer flowering version?
I have a few strains from Ace that Iām going to run over the next year or so. I want to have both a sativa and hybrid/indica running constantly. I have pretty much ignored the sativas and Iām trying to change that.
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@LoveDaAutos with Panama go for the longflowers for more power. Honestly Ace version barely had an effect on me at all. One had an OK buzz, but great flavor. Flowering time was actually 6-9 weeks, not longer like advertised. I picked the 6 weeker at week 8 and it was blah. Overdone, stigmas fallen off. Nothing noteworthy for my taste, but many people have found great plants.i hope yours turn out well for you.
Ace version had great vigor and structure. I vegged till plants were 18 inches. Harvest early for an Uppity buzz.
The 71 Panama was stunted by keeping it in small containers too long because I expected more stretch. There wasnāt too much.
It can be ( and was) flowered 12/12 from seed. Put in larger containers for some size.
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Thanks. It does look like thorns now that you mention it. Very cool. I canāt wait to see it in 2 weeks!
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If Iām going to grow Panama I want to grow āthe good stuffā and would dedicate my flowering tent (4x4) to that grow and run four Panama in it. In the last couple years Iāve worked hard to grow only top quality strains so I donāt see much sense if growing the Ace Seeds version.
This is what I would like to grow. This is beautiful!!
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Well, @LoveDaAutos you can scrap the veg time for the Panama longflower because you donāt need it. ( 18-20 weeks flowering)ā¦so minus 4-6 weeks, or whatever youād veg the Ace version, from the actual flowering time for an accurate comparison. So 12-16 weeks compared to 8-11ā¦or about a month longer for the grow, total. Hope that made sense.
Lots of people like the Ace version tooā¦
The Oaxaca you showed will be available at some point, but itās my breeding stock, so Iām going to hold it tight for now. I and others have the seeds from my original preservation and the Preservations they did with the seeds I passed out. People have been waiting a long time for seeds from me, but if you want, Iāll add you to the list for some of those. Thereās all sorts of other great phenos to be found. Itās probably going to be the fall before iām caught upā¦
I have a couple hundred+ packs to make up for the coop and the Freakers in addition to anyone else waiting. My early summer was severely screwed up this year and Iāve been playing catch up all summer.
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Yes sir it is! Absolutely stunning! Great work @Upstate
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I grew the original Mexican Sativa from Sensi Seeds and it was really good smoke. The plants were very hearty and vigorous. I remember the stem splitting into three main stalks and it basically grew itself. We got all females so couldnāt make seeds. I wish somebody still had that one!
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i think in this Panama Overview from Upstate the Snowhighs Panamared got a bit underrepresented.
ust saying, it flowers long (16 weeks or am i mistacken?), and its a absolute favorite of a longtime old stoner collegue , hunting for only middleamerican landraces ā¦
Called Panama74 , goes around on insta, you can google Panama74 to find it free thereā¦ i mean snowhigh asks 500 dollar. lol
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@romanoweed Snowhigh has more than one Panama line. Double Panama is BCO Panama Ć 74 red cross Panama. The Bco Panama is several lines mixed, with one line known to be a modern hybrid around 2002(?) Iām sure someone else also experienced the fifteen weeks I did, but the f2ās will have 20+ week plants along with shorter 15 weekers. When plants well into bloom are fully pollinated, they stop producing flowers, but if the seeds are done before the flowering term is done and conditions allow, they will fire up flowering again.
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yeah, but why speak about the cross with an indica`ish Panameseā¦ there is a highly rated panama74 from Snowhigh out there. lol
ok, Panama74 shows CBD influence on phylos. interestingā¦ (it matches with the CBD-cloud) but it flowers nicely long
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The first weed I ever smoked was Panama Red and it had red running through it. Effing awesome weed. 1980, I think.
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If you go on breedbay and look under landraces you might find more information
If I remember right a lot of those guys got Panama Red seeds Peace Corp person had them and gave them out on breedbay
That Peace corp is crossed to BCO who had a Panama Red in Colombia
Snowhigh will tell you exactly if you ask him about but he has also many versions of it
I think you have to recognize the name of the game being dont release these things āpureā
They are crossed and hybridized to preserve them and to be able to sell them without major backlash
There was a few types of Panama Red from snowhigh ā¦I think the PeaceCorp is one that is from the 70s but the 74 is something else
Panama74 is the drive behind the Cannabiogen was much more sativa and had tropical phenos
ACE even released a purple panama that was a fully tropicalplantā¦very Limited
Mine got lost to the mail
Anywayā¦the Panama74 is the one you want
Or look @ that Dr Greenthumb grow @ rollitupā¦Very tropical plantsā¦that may be the '74
I think many of the reds and golds must have migrated down to Panama/Colombiaā¦Paraquat drugwar drove them southā¦
It is legendary and the few times we got it People got so blazed they lost the bagā¦Looked everywhereā¦It was rolled up in someoneās pocketā¦and found in a search weeks days later having gone brown thru the washā¦ found when he got pat down going into a concert.
It was brilliant red/orange hairs It was very nice sativaā¦just mind blowing
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