1 kilo per light - or why gm/watt suck!

Terpenes are more than just aroma or flavor, they interact with the same receptors as THC and affects muscular relaxation, stress, mood, appetite, energy, inflammation, etc. Terpenes are measurable. As I’ve said in another thread, I think it’s the confluence of THC & terpenes that determine the total potency.

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Re-read his post (#7). The “6 lbs” was an extrapolation for a discussion (~3kg). He even notes that the extrapolation would also increase the power consumed along with area as a theoretical (not 320 W). And, nothing is really said about whether it’s a wet/dry weight.

I’d start with some questions there to get a better understanding on what he’s trying to convey.

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Yeah I’m definitely to high for that…lol. all I know is you ain’t getting 6lbs from a 370watt light #proveit.

However I absolutely agree 100% @Purple-N-Hairy
Crazy how everyone responds differently to terpene’s depending on their endocannabinoid system. I’m more interested in high terpene’s than I am high thc. I’m currently growing some $$$ ass seeds that are supposed to have a very high complex terpene profile.

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I do know that if you train the branches out sideways when in veg that you will end up with a cola on every branch seen it done outdoors similar results for tieing plants over in an arch shape all the branches become cola sites it also makes the plant sturdier in my opinion more hedge/bush like

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As far as the thread topic goes I’ve seen a few kilo+ per 1000w strains. One was an old 90s white widow cut we had that would yield 2.5lbs or even a bit more, serious seeds chronic would hit 2+, and black domina.

Edit: a friend also had a 'willies wonder’s cut that would yield 2+ easily, but it wasn’t very good haha

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3 a light…not sure if 3 pounds or 3 kilos…lol…more than likely pounds.
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If I hit a gram a watt I pat myself on the back and say “good job Foreigner!”

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if you really wanted to fuck with someone’s mind you could come in and plop a bomb like I got ten million grams from a single plant! under 1000 watts! Then explain how you re-vegged the same plant over and over under 1000watt and you lived for a thousand years …

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Et tu @LemonadeJoe ? :slight_smile:

(sigh) Once again, no one actually reads my posts all the way through.

Ok, so tell me this. How good is a measuring tool for comparing anything to anything else when absolutely no one knows the actual size of the unit of measure?

If my “foot” is 13 inches and your “foot” is 11 inches, and Sams “foot” is actually in centimeters, and Bill has no idea how big his really is, and Bob got his from china (its “rated” for 18" but is really only 4"), and Howard takes a simple average of his height devided by 3.333, and Max uses the distance from his elbow to his toes, and Wanda (who is very cute and smart) agrees with me - then who the heck is tallest if we all compare measurements?

Thats the exact situation when using grams/watt or grams/fixture.

There is no agreed upon “standard” for what we mean by “watts”.

Adding in time in the form of KWH does make it slightly better, but you are still stuck with the wild variations in what exactly constitutes “watts” when we do these comparisons.

Are we ALL using watts from the wall, or watts on the label, or watts measured during veg or flower or peak watts or average watts or LED watts or MH watts or CFL watts or flouro watts?

That doesnt even begin to cover variations like distance from the canopy, ON time vrs OFF time or the use of sunrise/sunset dimmers, or 3000k vrs 5000k, or far red or near red, or, or , or…

What about guys who run autos on a fixed 18/6 schedule or even 24/0 for the entire grow?

Anyone using a cheap chinese fixture is screwed if they are using the label watts thats for sure.

Watts has no agreed upon “standard” in our hobby. You cannot just use volts x amps. Its way beyond that.

If there is no agreed upon STANDARD that EVERYONE uses, then there can be no comparison.

Grams/KWH will get you a number you can use on your personal grows to judge cost efficiency, but it is still useless to compare YOUR grow to MY grow unless we agree on ALL the other factors that go into it. Plus, I dont know of anyone who measures that.

If you are using 1000 watt MH, and Im using 1000 watt LED, you will always loose.

You cannot compare LED watts to MH watts - and thats just one point where GM/Watt doesnt work.

Ive already gone over why grams/fixture is even worse.

First: Phooey - no one can “prove” anything on the internet. I would have to invite you over to help me do the harvest, and have you bring your own scale! :slight_smile:

If you read through all my posts, on all my threads (I know you didnt because that would take like forever :wink: ) then you would have seen pics where I show the scale readings from time to time. Even then, how would you know I didnt slip some lead shot into the tray with the bud?

Second: As @Northern_Loki said - are you talking dry weight or wet weight? Do you take your dry bud out of the jars and weight it? I dont dry my bud in jars, so that doesnt even apply to me.

Im talking wet, freshly cut bud weights. Which is all Ive seen anyone post when they say how much they harvested.

Those dry weights I mention are mostly calculated. I almost never bother to re-weigh after drying. The one exception to that was my last grow - that you quoted above) because I accidentally over dried my buds because I forgot them. That made me curious about how dry they were, so I re-weighed them.

For some odd reason, I have gotten into the habit of calculating aprox dry weights and using that to figure my grams/day yields. Here is the quote from the post where I added up the final numbers:

"Final numbers are 2937 gms wet. Using my 26% dry weight number that works out to around 761 gms dry or an average of 254 gm per plant. It took 96 days from seed, so thats 7.9 gms/day. Thats just amazing to me and way beyond expectations. Its also my highest ever gm/day yield."

I said this before - I believe in posting the good along with the bad - including the utter failures and stupid screw ups. Other wise, no one can learn from my experiences. My memory is so bad these days, I need to post the bad stuff so I can remember NOT to do that next time! :slight_smile:

So, believe me or not. Its your choice, but PLEASE stop using gm/watt!! :slight_smile:

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Am I reading correctly, 3000g under 320w?
If you adjust the wattage for the light output of old HIDs that’s right up there with Heath Robinson’s best attempts. Bravo dude.

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(sigh) yes.

Thats fresh cut, wet weight.

See the above post.

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Lmfao. I used to have a teacher that would say “If you have a question wait 5 minutes it’ll probably be answered.”
In this case that was literally true.

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I need to say this again - forget the lights or watts or fixtures. Thats irrelevant and (almost) immaterial as far as Im concerned.

Growing technique has far more to do with yields than lights.

Im telling you guys - the key is proper use of a scrog screen. They are not just to keep colas from falling over :wink:

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My favorite teacher of all time was in geometry. His favorite saying was “Flip back to the previous page in the book if you really want to know how to solve that problem.” :slight_smile:

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Very true, but to date the most cost effective grow I’ve ever seen would likely be Heath’s 4’ cube, flooded tube vertical. You ever seen it?

2x600w hid, hung bare bulb vertically, covering something like <64sq.ft. of canopy in an NFT. A res at the bottom with a pump to bring the water to the top of a pvc spiral, gravity brings it back downstream across, idk, <128 clones, maybe a lot less I don’t remember.
His yield was something pretty extravagant for the times. 3+ per watt, no veg. And I completely agree g/w is designed to be abused, and G/KwH adds in that time factor that we need in order for that data to actually means something

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I remember looking at his setup, but I wasnt interested in the lighting as soon as I saw it would never work for me. I was interested in how he was doing the NFT. That was when I was first looking into details on different hydro systems.

You have reminded me of the other major flaw in gm/watt - time. Time isnt the only missing element, but its a big one.

Take two of my recent grows. These are off the cuff numbers - I havent looked up the exact numbers, but this is in the ball park.

One grow got me around 2000 grams wet at harvest. On my 320 watt fixture - assuming I ran full power/24/7 for the whole grow - thats 2000/320 = 6.25 gm/watt. Not bad.

My next grow only netted me 1000 grams for the same 320 watts = 3.125 gm/watt.

So that second grow really sucked compared to the first grow - or did it?

The first grow took over 5 months = roughly 168 days from seed. Thats 2000/168 = 11.9 gms per day of growing.

The second grow only took 87 days, so it worked out to 1000/87 = 11.49 gms per day of growing.

In other words, the two grows netted me almost the exact same grams for every day of growing, even though the grams per watt were wildly different.

Grams/watt suck :slight_smile:

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Sorry Joe. Im glad @LemonadeJoe took this mess out of your thread. I was feeling bad for derailing it so badly.

Im not 100% sure what you mean by psychogenic properties, but your probably right that they would be hard to measure :slight_smile:

I agree with you 100% about needing to agree on the metric - as I said above several times - which is why Im so much against gm/watt. :slight_smile:

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The biggest flaw in measuring by grams per watt is that it doesn’t specify between weighing when dry or wet in the title

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Lol. Damn good point @cultivatorkid Standard should always be buds trimmed naked, ~65% humidity stable at 65F.
Measuring by wet weight gives the impression we haven’t trimmed the buds or removed the stalks and stems.

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Just to be clear - my wet weights are trimmed weights - no stems. However, I keep anything that is frosty - including sugar leaves and fan leaves if they are frosty enough. I also probably keep more small buds than you smokers. I only do green dragon and tinctures/capsules, so if it has frost, I keep it. Im guessing my weight might be 5% higher than a close trim?

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