Breeding exclusivly with reversed plants

[HolyAngel]

Some big claims there… We’ve mostly sequenced one cultivated clone-only and not anything else. And we basically have no idea what any of it means. The majority of the gene’s have not been mapped yet.

@LonelyOC

the hot take on the Y chromosome in cannabis plant is that it contains less autonome data then X and that it’s less chromosome data then X

The cannabis male Y chromosome is actually larger than the X chromosome, not the reverse.
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41438-020-0295-3#:~:text=The%20Y%20chromosome%20is%20larger,be%20843%20Mb10%2C11.
If you’re saying the (most likely) functional data inside the chromosome, then sure, the X has more of what looks to be functional data than the Y does, but we still have no idea how or what either of those functions do.

We don’t even know if cannabis is x/y, x-to-autosome, or purely autosomal or what. There’s theories, most lately are leaning towards x-to-autosome. But we don’t know.

We do know there are X-linked traits, like the Freakshow line. That leaf trait is an X-linked recessive trait. So what traits could be linked to the Y?

[LonelyOC]

I think that you misunderstood me. I was meaning to convey that the Y chromosome does have more over all data then X, but that both the autonome data and chromosome(the data within the chromosomes that are linked to sex) data is less and that the extra data of the Y is a repeatable pattern.

Sex traits in male plants often have to do with the antlers. This is very easy to observe in reversed plants where the female form antlers in “bud clusters”, while males usually form antlers in the “armpits”.

I’ve actually found out that there are A LOT of genetic data on cannabis. More then we publicly know. Most of it are held by companies in Israel and Italy. It would be super interesting to get to look at their research. It’s especially focused on cancer killing cannabis cultivars and in the search of understanding why it’s cancer killing and what the genetical difference are between cannabis cultivars.

Pz

[ChongoBongo]

@Fuel

And let’s speak true, I’ve more often met (real) breeders disgusted to be forced by the customers to release fems to pay the bills, than the reverse.

that’s an awfully entitled way to look at the people paying their bills

@LonelyOC

There are ZERO scientific substance in that cannabis males have some special sauce or that plants from female to female interaction would be inferior in any way, shape or form

the only problem I can see is if you intended to reintroduce males back into the line to make regular seeds again. Due to sex-limited, sex-linked, and sex-influenced genes, female plants could be carriers of deleterious genes that will only express themselves in their male progeny. BUT I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that it isn’t a big issue in reality. Just a guess

[LonelyOC]

@ChongoBongo Yes, you are correct in a way! But this is a general problem with males and is not specific to female to female breeding.

The autonome data in the Y chromosome is only given
to males. This part of the dna is not passed down to females since only the X chromosome are passed down to the female progeny. So this data is only a concern for male progeny.

A sex linked trait in the autonomes can go by undetected if your progeny only consist of girls, and when you introduce a male into the mix, all male progeny down the line will either have suppressed traits so they can be hard to select or have enhanced traits, so they will look better then they are. But since its linked to the male sex, this is not something you will have issue with in the female side of the population, unless you intend to breed with the line. Then these sex linked suppressors/enhancers can make the selection work really hard.

This is one of the reasons why I chose female to female crosses when I made custom medicine when I was a caretaker. Males can fool you and when you have a very specific goal that is often the matter of someone’s health. You want to squeeze that time frame as short as possible. Now we are talking months to get to the point of success.

Some breeders have a longer time frame, let’s say 3+ years. Then having these type of problems with male progeny is not the end of the world and you start to know your work and cultivar in and out. Line breeding and continuous testing of progeny is crucial to keep the eye on the price, and not gamble too much.

Pz

[ChongoBongo]

@LonelyOC

A sex linked trait […] can go by undetected if your progeny only consist of girls

Yep, that was the exact point I was trying to make👍