I always assumed the plants that are stalled up top are growing down below. Any idea how do the roots compare?
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Maybe your temps are a lil on the cool side?
Did you get any specific growing info for that specific strain?
Maybe more light?
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Yeah, and expensive one too.
The roots are similarly stunted, and they are resisting getting fuzzy much more than the other test plants I have been running at the same time.
Canna-Cheese:
This is the three of yours I ran at the same age. Even the runt on the right has a root mass that was several times larger. Couldnt fit the entire mass in one pic because they went from the top almost to the bottom of the chamber at this age.
The only recommendation was to keep night time temps during flower above 77F - and that was primarily for potency. Ive been running from 79-81 or so. The light should be fine. If anything Im pushing it a tiny bit for this age. Ive been running between 24 - 28 watts/sq ft.
These are just suck ass seeds.
I already have two of @Sebring Waterstone seedlings in the system. I just put two more of his seeds in paper towels. If this baby doesnt get its legs in the next few days - before they get big enough - I will be killing the canna and put the bigger of of Sebring’s in its place.
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I feel the need to be at least somewhat fair to the Mephisto folks. The majority of people seem to be real happy with their grows - but - I have found there are a significant number of people reporting similar issues over on Auto Flower Network. Its not just this strain.
To be fair, their success rate is probably not any worse than any other breeder - although they do get defensive when problems are posted and dont offer any replacements. We have all gotten bad seeds at one time or another, and this time it was my turn. It just seems to me that the hype is way out of proportion to the reality.
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I’m sorry to hear you aren’t having any luck with those beans. I wish I could offer an explanation. [Knock on wood] I’ve had 100% germination with all the Mephisto strains I’ve tried.
Here are my current three seedlings:
L to R: CannaCheese, Hubbabubbasmelloscope, Walter White. The latter two are 24 days old and the CannaCheese was planted 20 days ago. I start them in Solo cups and recently transplanted into Octopots.
I hope you get great results from what remains. Good luck!
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I am glad your grow is going well. Im curious - how big around are those pots? Actually, Id rather know how big that canna is across. My baby is only about 2" across on the biggest dimension.
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To be fair [insert Letterkenny joke], mine were 1/2 Mephisto (Ghost Toof).
My guess is the breeder focused more on the cannabinoid ratio and less on vigor and yield. For what you paid, you might as well finish them. I have noticed Mephisto seeds likes to put on a lot if growth during early flower.
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Not to derail here, but how well do the octopots perform for you?
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also consider your trying to grow autos in a rather unforgiving grow style for them where hindrances or hiccups at the start can and do have consequences, not saying we all don’t get dud seeds now and then as i just did with some fastbud seeds its just regardless things happen that may be outside our current realm of control.
As for mephisto the hype has definitely gotten larger than it should probably be due to that sense of scarcity that tends to do that, my own experience has been mixed with their seeds and any future purchases im only gonna go with their main lines, not any of the side cross illumiauto stuff
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I love them. You get the advantages of soil and hydro while avoiding many of their drawbacks. The plants are so easy to care for. I still check on them every day, but they each have a 5 gallon reservoir and can be left alone for over a week in veg or multiple days in flower. You don’t have to worry about how much water to provide since the plants drink as they see fit. It’s a form of automation that requires no moving parts, timers, pumps, or electricity. I’ve grown the same plants side by side in fabric pots and the ones in Octopots grow faster and yield better.
I also like that buying Octopots supports a small family business and that they are made in USA.
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Thanks for the thoughtful reply.
How do you nutrient feed?
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I’ve mentioned it in my grow thread. I mix nutrients in a 5 gallon bucket, then use an auto-siphon to fill the reservoir:
The green bucket sits on a step stool. The auto-siphon moves the liquid through tubing to the red funnel into the rez.
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Interesting. I had no clue. But i did really like your seeds 
Id say they focused a little too hard when it came to my seeds! Hmmm. Now you have me second guessing tossing this last one out. Its actually a very happy looking stunted little runt at the moment, and the roots are starting to develop some more fuzzy hairs. It has actually grown a bit since yesterday too. I think your comment about already having this much invested is what hit home mostly though 
No worries. My threads tend to wander all over the place
Good point. If you have been following any of my grows, you know I have lots of experience in hindering young and old plants in my system!!
However, in my earlier grows, the babies always recovered quickly and went back to previous growth rates. The main downside I saw with my screw ups was an extended time before they were ready to harvest. Major screw ups seemed to add about 1 week each time. With those Ghost Toof plants for example, I almost killed the roots at least three different times. That seemed to add about 3 weeks to the normal growing times - but - I still had my best ever yield with autos - and some dam potent meds at the end. Actually, those plants were my best ever yield period as far as grams/day.
These guys did have some small stress early on with the transfer to the foam pucks, but it was way below what other autos I have grown have suffered and just shrugged off. The main difference is these babies never had a growth rate to begin with.
Still, this one has maybe another week before I have to make the final decision.
I think you are exactly right about that. Plus, people seem to always be searching for that mysterious, mythical, newest, fanciest, most rumored, as seen in some YouTube video, “something” that will help them achieve a better harvest. I am just as guilty of that as anyone. Well, except for the Youtube video part. I absolutely HATE videos. Dont even get me started
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Maybe also one thing to consider, this the first time you basically started out the seed in the system right? Maybe that has something to do with it?
I def think you should give it a go, but I am a lil biased just cause I want to see what happens with it…
I will say, with my somewhat limited knowledge, while maybe stunted, the color looks damn healthy!
Also, I feel like you had a theory a little while ago about having the flow being a lil on the wet side for early early growth? Maybe since you went for fuzzies so early on it stunted it?
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Your questions and @Mr.Sparkle’s comments on early stress made me re-think this a bit.
In the past when ever I have stressed the plants or roots, it has always been easy to see in the leaves. Its just like nute burn, or bad PH, etc etc. The leaves tell you that something is wrong right away or within a day or two.
This plant has never looked bad other than a little pale earlier when I was still holding the EC down for some new additions. So your comment about it looking good is on-point - but - I think it shows that this plant has not been stressed. I think its just the genetics as @ReikoX mentioned above.
As far as the new technique for starting seeds in the system, dont forget that I tried that several times before I put these babies in the system, and it worked just fine as far as the health of the babies. The problems I had with the earlier trials were not due to stress but rather with the mechanics of supporting the roots and stems and making the transfer to the pucks. Over all, I am still convinced that starting them early in the system is lower stress than the old way of transferring them from perlite.
I am very careful when it comes to reducing flow rates, and so far I have not reduced it enough to cause any kind of stress. Im still running well above the ‘dry’ stage with lots of droplets all over the roots at all times.
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Well its more that some plants and definitely in the auto realm if they do hit stressors they may not show it in the leaves mind you your runt pics above show a little but the plants just slow right up kinda like they are shocked and trying to figure out what to do next, now whether that’s plant specific or genetic related ive seen both but when plant specific its usually when the initial tap root gets damaged in some way or hits an obstacle it has to get around causing it to hold up growth till it works around that situation, obviously thats not really a trait we want but from a survival standpoint there is a reason why its there.
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That makes perfect sense to me. My only counter is that if these babies are reacting to stress of some sort, they sure seem to be far more sensitive than any other autos Ive grown in the system.
I may not have mentioned it in this thread, but I did nothing for 7 months earlier this year - from about April through the start of this grow in late Oct - but kill off seedlings doing experiments on all aspects of the system. I have collected many seeds I never will try to grow again, so they were my sacrificial babies. I would make a change to the system, then start two seeds and see how it went. While they were getting started I played with all sorts of timing and nozzles variations. I pushed the limits as far as I could - deliberately going too far to see how the plants reacted. Plus, for most of that time I was running waaaaaaay too much chlorine in the system due to a stupid math error. Im claiming it was while I was stoned 
Over that 7 months I think I killed off at least 2 dozen babies. When I say killed off I mean I took them out of the system and tossed them. They did NOT die on their own due to the stress. I was just ready to try something new and wanted a fresh start.
None of those test subjects grew this slowly even with far more serious stress. To me that indicates this degree of stress reaction is an inherent trait in these particular seeds that I got.
Of course, there is no telling how others will do, and @BarefootAndBlazed posted pics above showing his canna-cheese baby doing much better. His is still a little on the small side for this age but not really outside the range you could expect to see.
On the plus side - the baby continues to look really happy - and - its even growing some! So, I think I will keep it at least a few more days. If this trend continues, it will have earned a reprieve!
This grow is down to one Mephisto plant (for now) and Im adding two of @sebrings Waterstone babies to fill the other two spots in my system. I think I will change the thread title and just post progress on the Waterstone here rather than start a new thread. I dont think anyone has finished a grow of Waterstone yet with the new seeds.
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I also got some of those in the mail the other day from that seed drop, have to wait on some space though, and if you knew my habits 2 dozen seedlings over 7 months seems minor in comparison lol others around here bug me on that often.
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LOL I am glad Im not the only one around here that abuses babies!!
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