Also, no, I don’t think cannabis arrived with the cows sometime after the creation of colonial German East Africa in 1880, I think it was imported to the continent centuries before that and you’re having a hard time wrapping your head around how old global trade, commerce, and cultural exchange is, literally thousands of years.
3 Likes
Earlier in this thread there is mention of an Egyptian deity named Bes. A fertility deity that has been seen with offerings that included cannabis leaf. Bes culture was brought to the Nile Valley by the inhabitants of the bush regions of Central Africa that followed the waterways that eventually led to the land of the Pharaohs. King Solomon had an Egyptian weed dealer. Cannabis has been in Africa long before the Europeans arrived to colonize.
Pangea allowed for seeds, fauna and mankind to begin spreading all over the globe. Cannabis beginning in the Mongolian steppe sounds great, but it’s just one version of ancient history. It’s a reach to think that life begins in Africa millions of years ago, no weed was found anywhere or even brought back over there. No birds flying and pooping after eating hemp? Nahhhhhh…
3 Likes
i never ment to say there was no weed in africa before.
i just wanted to balance the thread with giving upstates hemp theory (german guys introducing it in 1950) some credit, cause these swiss cows, and how the black guys made the cheese swissstyle after 70 years now still.
Nor did i wanna say weed originated in africa.
It’s true that there was definitely cannabis use in Egypt, though I don’t put a lot of stock in the testing of mummies that gets cited, I think that was more likely coked and hashed up workers and academics contaminating the artifacts. The biggest question really is when did they start growing the plants for resin rather than the other cannabinoids and health benefits we all know know come with eating the green leaf or the seeds? Africa has many native smokable psychoactive plants, so I don’t think it would take long for it to be tried but the question remains about where it came from as NLD/BLD rather than hemp.
http://antiquecannabisbook.com/chap1/Egyptian.htm
The Bes thing is interesting, since he’s clearly a Pygmy god and there’s that apothecary jar at the Rosicrucian Egyptian Museum. Egyptian records say that the first expedition into central Africa was around 2500 BC under Pharaoh Nefrikare:
“Egyptian king Nefrikare sent an expedition into central Africa and it returned with a dancing dwarf known as Akka. In the pyramid text of the sixth-dynasty monarch Pepi I it is declared that, “He who is between the thighs of Nut is the Pygmy who danceth like the god and who pleaseth the heart of the god before his great throne.” Nut was the goddess of heaven and the mother of Osiris. This Pygmy was called Bes.”
1 Like
i just wanted to clarify: i think we had slight missunderstanding:
I personally consider TIME an important factor.
You mentioned the 1800s and “lots of trades”.
nice-
The question for me is: how fast does something adabt…
I think alot of percentage of African Genetics came over middle east, but also a good amount from India?
Anyway, i think it would have adabted if brought in 1800 ? and quiet alot? probably. yes.
And thats the missunderstanding.
You ment with adaption; resistance changes, or minor things… I meant: it may change everything.
And nobody really anwsered me that.
The degrees… of adaption, or not…
So, for me a trade in 1800 is less important than a possible trade or hemp in 1950… short before the 70s hippies somked it…
@slain selected a pure Vietblack for shorter floweringtime … Atleast i guess its pure, he needed quiet a few generations for just 1 to 2 weeks flowering-reduction… But still thats a tempo… His vietblack looks quiet fatass in meantime…
1 Like
My man, Dirt. 
NLD/BLD is indeed the question. That is what we are “hashing out” (pun intended), in these intellectual exchanges passing along useful information like the joints, blunts and bongs that brought us to this very moment.
That pygmy that got the Pharaoh stoned, didn’t come with some weak shit. It had already been worked enough to have some potency.
When I smoke with my friends from East Africa we often get into cultivation talks. Their perspective is very useful because it’s a window into the ways their long family lines have been working the land. The answers that we seek to points of origin or modification may surface in unconventional, tangential ways.
2 Likes
And the egyptian trades you speak about i think are 2000 years ago or so… you dont think it would totally adapt and change shape in this time?
Meh… You don’t know what you don’t know. Much has been kept from outsiders for a long time, seed stock/genetics included. There are maps of ancient Earth that are still in private libraries separated by cultural curtains of silence. The answers to these questions are obscured temporarily, but they will surface.
1 Like
yep, we are missing out on the best stuff, the books of proove
East Africa does have a very long history of smoking cannabis flower or resin, distinct from the Arabic traditions of oral hashish consumption or vaporizing it in a narghile. This paper is old but still one of the best I’ve found at explaining some of the deeper academic theories about the ancient spread of cannabis from anthropological and ethnographic perspectives:
Page 6 is Africa, my apologies for the length of this excerpt but it’s very good:
“There is one additional route which must be evaluated, although
this has not been incorporated in any of the theories discussed
above: a spread from south Arabia through Ethiopia. The Semitic
origins of the Amhara people is well established, but a variety of
products preceded and followed this invasion. Thus, Simoons
(1965) suggests that contacts between ancient Cushitic peoples
and settlements north of the Red Sea were continued in later times
when Amhara settlers continued these contacts. In the process,
plough agriculture, a zebu strain of cattle, and various agricultural
products spread to Ethiopia. The question that arises is whether
Cannabis could have been one of these products. Recently Van der
Merwe reported on two ceramic pipe bowls excavated at Lalibela
cave near Lake Tana. Both were parts of water-pipes and had been
impregnated with definite cannabis-derived compounds. The
author concluded that ‘some variety of Cannabis sativa was
smoked around Lake Tana in the 13th-14th century, in much the
same way as it is today’ (1975:80).
The importance of the Lake Tana find and the associated radio-
carbon dates are of significance. They imply either that Cannabis
entered Ethiopia from southern Arabia, or that it spread from the
east African coast in a northerly direction from Bantu-speaking to
S.Afr.Tydskr.Etnol., 1996,19(4)
Cushitic peoples. One problem is that Lake Tana is in the north
central part of Ethiopia. Can a trade route be postulated between
the present-day Kenya and northern Ethiopia? If so, was Cannabis
traded southwards to the Bantu-speaking peoples? If Cannabis
was introduced to the east coast by early Arab traders, could it
then have been traded northward into Ethiopia?
If, however, we are dealing with the diffusion of Cannabis from
the north (particularly Egypt) into Ethiopia, and Rosenthal sug-
gests that ‘the use of hashish spread through India, China and
Ethiopia … .’ (1971 :45), there remains one critical issue involving
the way it was used. Referring to the use of hashish in medieval
Muslim society, Rosenthal emphatically states that ‘in our sources,
hashish is never described as having been smoked’ (ibid:65). Since
the estimated date for the Lake Tana excavation is no more than a
century later than most of the references used by Rosenthal, we are
dealing either with a very rapid innovation in the method of use, or
with an independent usage of smoking Cannabis. According to
this scenario, Cannabis and the water pipe might have been carried
from Persia via Syria to Ethiopia.
The available evidence then seems to allow for a possible trans-
portation of Cannabis from Syria to Ethiopia and then southward.
Posnansky points out that ‘evidence of a trickle of peoples from
the Horn in the last millennium of the pre-Christian era is available
from the Erythriote (or caucasoid) skeletal remains from the Horn,
Kenya, Tanzania and Malawi’ (1966:89). The first contacts with
Khoikhoi found them to possess ‘a form of zebu cow which probably accompanied them sometime in the first half of the present
millennium if pottery parallels between East Africa and South
Africa are any indication of a folk movement’ (Posnansky
1966:89). I have already mentioned dagga, the Khoikhoi word for
tobacco, and its possible link with duXan. If the hypothesis out-
lined here is seriously considered, it would imply that the
Khoikhoi had contact - first-hand or indirectly - with Ethiopia and
then spread across southern Africa prior to the Bantu expansion.
This would account for the possession of pottery, cattle, and
vocabulary items linking them to early Ethiopian connections. It
would also explain why they employed smoking pipes.
An alternative explanation, of course, is that Cannabis and the
water pipe diffused from East Africa. This would certainly tie in
with the data concerning terminological diffusion. The alternative
also rests heavily on a dispersal from the south into Ethiopia along
trade routes described for a later period by Richard Pankhurst
(1965). Following this line of inquiry, the early Ethiopian residents
around Lake Tana would then have adopted smoking and the water
pipe from their southern neighbours.
Just as likely a hypothesis is one that postulates the spread of
Cannabis from earlier Arab settlements or Indian trade centres
around the Horn of Africa. Diffusion would then have been
effected along the salt-trade routes discussed by Abir (1966). This
would even allow for the spread of Cannabis directly from India,
since it is recognized that, in the tenth century, ‘Indian merchants
were visiting Sokotra in vessels called baraja, and (that) they were
often in conflict with the Muslims’ (Pankhurst1974:186).
If the Horn of Africa is recognized as a diffusion centre, it
would imply that these Indian traders used the water pipe and
introduced it along with Cannabis, or that they learned about the
water pipe from Arab traders during these excursions, or, finally,
that the water pipe was independently invented near Lake Tana, a
somewhat unlikely conclusion in the light of the subsequent diffusion of the water pipe. According to this scenario, the Cannabis-
smoking-terminology would have spread southward as a complex,
i.e. the water-pipe and the smoking of bang would have spread
together.”
Brian du Toit, University of Florida, 1996
AJA02580144_686.pdf (455.5 KB)
2 Likes
Yeah ok besides that Libgen download of the Duvall book on Africa and cannabis I found a few of the academic articles he published when working on it:
Also this older academic article by Brian du Toit but I need to get access:
5 Likes
thank you! looks like a very deilled, good read!
1 Like
The previous Article seems to conclude: because there was a spread of smoked Cannabis from Ethiopia thowards below, the guy concludes it African genetics might have spread over Ethiopia southwards. right? i think he says thats the most likely scenario. and rather than it spread from south to north.
jesus i need sleep. good night
2 Likes
Du Toit is a weird guy, an South African who wrote a bunch of ethnographic histories of Boer/Afrikaner settlers and then the diaspora after the Boer war, and then also extensively about cannabis, a funny combo considering that the Boers were generally deeply Protestant Calvinists who thought fun was a sin. His books were printed in small numbers but they’re held in academic libraries, they’re on my list to check out when I get to Harvard or Yale:
1 Like
AJA00382353_6268.pdf (1.2 MB)
1 Like
2 Likes
Nice! Thank you for that, let me share with you this really in depth thesis I just found when I was digging around:
2 Likes
Aw sick I found the publication that Du Toit “Dagga” presentation is in and that conference was not only a banger but copies of the proceedings are also held at 1,400 libraries, including the college next to my house. I’m gonna have to get in there and look at it, but it looks like there’s digital access through EBSCO that I could wrangle too.
https://worldcat.org/en/title/564648900
And one last paper for the night and I’m off to bed:
High Points: An Historical Geography of Cannabis
October 2014Geographical Review 104(4)
DOI:10.1111/j.1931-0846.2014.12038.x
Authors:
Barney Warf
University of Kansas
Cannabis.pdf (245.6 KB)
2 Likes
Right
There are purple and blacks throughout non-Arab Africa.
But the Black Magic African popularized by DJ Short and servicemen was a curing process. They all described it as looking moldy and crumbly. Thanks to Tang, we have proof of how cobbing works on various strains.
4 Likes
Honestly, shit like this is why you arent taken seriously.
Spend time on Jstor and Ncbi and less time in dream land.
Resin has a lipid shell. Double bonded at that.
You know oil does not diffuse into water, right?
Leaving a flowering plant in the rain doesnt wash away the resin. Just look at all the sativas. The SE Asian lines that flower through monsoon seasons. Shit, if your delusion was accurate, nobody in SE Asia would be getting high.
Please, take a few courses at the local community college.
College teaches one the very important skill of challenging one’s own thoughts.
3 Likes