Seed/Pollination Question

Breeder's Lab
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#1

Hello all - first time posting on OG!

I am growing several plants from fem seeds, and am hoping to reverse a couple of clones using GA3 or colloidal silver to derive some seeds. This is not a breeding or crossing project, just a way of retaining some backups in seed form.

On the one hand, I can apply pollen from the reversed clone to another clone from the same mother/phenotype (as in, basically to itself) to get what I believe are called “S1” seeds. On the other hand, I can apply that same pollen to another pheno of the same strain.

Is there any major difference in result between these two approaches? I read somewhere that S1’s may have less vigor, but that seeds from two different pheno’s of the same strain retain basically the same stability genetics-wise, but produce seeds that promise more vigorous growth.

Any thoughts? Am I overthinking this?

Thanks!

Vesti

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#2

Hi bro it depends if phenotype ,are the 2 truly the same then no difference but just say plant # 2 has some different traits then plant #1 so depending on what the gene pool is like it can be a bit different it could lean to on side or another of the original parents
If the 2 plants are from the same mother then no different at all

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#3

Welcome to OG, good to see you.

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#4

Hey man, thanks for the note.

Ok, so if I understand, your experience is that an S1 is likely no less viable/vigorous than “mating” two different plants from the same strain. Excellent.

The phenos are a bit different, but final product/effects are basically the same. I’m just a closet grower for household use, and with my limited space keeping mothers is just not practical. I want good product, but don’t really have the wherewithal for fine tuning via large pheno hunts.

The main strain I want to back up is a pretty well balanced hybrid from the Garden of Green folks called Kush n’ Cookies CBD (in smaller amounts it gives a nice daytime buzz, a bit more at night and it’s off to good sleep - not my absolute favorite, but a really great strain all-around).

Question out of curiosity - I know a plant pollinating itself creates S1 seeds, and a first generation cross of two different strains creates “unstable” F1 seeds. What designation is given to seeds from pollinating two different plants (from different seeds) of the same stable strain? Are they still “F1”?

Thanks again, Papalag, and be well!

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#5

Thanks, Guitarzan! It’s good to be here.

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#6

Welcome to OG.

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#7

I that that would be called a bx1 (backcross 1), but I’m no expert :thinking:

#8

I believe they are f1
Now sprout the f1 and pollinate the offspring with pollen from the offspring it’s now f2 and so on I believe less verity in the f 3

#9

Thanks, glad to have found the site!

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#10

naming wise depends on how deep you want to get into it and what true classifications are in say actual agriculture and science vs us home growers, as there are points that are out there for definition.

But in our past and terms used in the community F1 is and has been acceptable, really so long as you can follow and express that to others if need be is all that matters on a base level.

As for crossing to clones vs another strain expression , the clones will be most like the parent and the vigor aspect is more apparent in further generations but imo is no different than within the same strain.

As for that F1 being unstable, actually id say its the opposite in that what comes out is usually pretty even, its on the next generation that things diverge and you get to see more distinct expressions.

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#11

Makes sense - thanks.

I’ll keep you posted!

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#12

Thanks, MS, that’s really helpful.

Yea, I know there tends to be some slippage between strict scientific terminology and the more colloquial/jargony use these terms sometimes acquire (as I understand it, the terms “strain” and “variety” are similarly fraught.