Yeah, thats an awesome breeding background since breeding good dogs are hard! Have you tried Ace Malawi, had a mother testing 25% thc and people thought that i laced it with X for the racey heart beat and trippy effects. It only went for 13 weeks aswell. Not like my old A5 which was an 18weeker and wasnt as racey and trippy, but a Great tool for breeding!
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So you understand what Iām talking about. When everyone was crossing cookies, I stayed away from it. Partly because of no access in my area. But Iām glad I did because it takes all the fun out of smoking cannabis.
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Ok, as I understand it, there is a physiological and genetic trade off.
As for the first one, thatās the one I should be interested in as a grower.
But I am interested in the latter. It is an interesting topic and seems important from an evolutionary perspective.
If certain traits are linked by a trade off mechanism, then during breeding it is impossible for certain phenotypes to appear. If you grow a variety with a high percentage of THC, you cannot expect high CBD at the same timeā¦ It can be the other way around, or balanced
I have no idea about the subject, but it seems important in breeding anything
As far as I can see, todayās breeders mostly are going in the same direction. Increase in yield, potencyā¦ Is there trade off traits conectedā¦
In this topic, there was talk about breeding 1:1 and omitting a wide range of essential traits of the population. A matter of numbers
But this seems different to me
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I havenāt tried ace malawi but it sound like my type of smoke. I donāt dwell too much on the numbers. But prefer to concentrate on the effects.
I breed effects that complement each other. Once I got it lined out how I like it, I then breed it to other plants so they will exhibit similar effects.
You never know when something that you like even better will appear.
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Good questionā¦
As far as I can see, todayās breeders mostly are going in the same direction. Increase in yield, potencyā¦ Is there trade off traits conectedā¦
An example is heavy branches falling overā¦thereās a molecular trade off in there that will reduce the progeny that does thatā¦of course we as humans null that by selection. But itās there!
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Heh, Iāve seen the exact opposite. Most breeders seem to be breeding for bag appeal and terpenes (cookies?) without any regard to the high or potency. Much less structure or anything else. Think it was Skunktek that said he doesnāt even smoke his own plants. How you gonna expect to breed anything good relying solely on 3rd parties? Even worse, breeders breeding because of the names attached. Yield is easy to breed for.
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Aceās Malawi contains some kind of indica in there. I have had some pure malawi though that was absolutely fantastic. No body buzz really but man, felt like microdosing shrooms on a glorious day. Everything just looked better and couldnāt help but be happy about everything. Still miss that stuff. I got some seeds but havenāt gotten to them yet. Not sure theyāll have it either.
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Indeed, im into the same type of weed. It helped me get through university. Giving high energy and focus. In Sweden we pretty much only got hashish from Afghanistan or marocco. But sometimes we get Nepal sativa temple balls and I would love them. Always brought atleast 50gs at once. When i started to grow when i was 18 and had moved to my own place i started to grow C99 and grapefruit. Thought it was the best sativa 
But later tried a super silver haze and it got the same feeling as the temple balls. So i snowed in on sativas a couple of years until i begun helping out others with medical cannabis and indica is the dominant domain when it comes to treat most diseases. I always kept that Killer Malawi to produce my own stash. I still got BX3 S1 seeds of it. I hope they would still germ. Ive not kept it in the freezer for 3 yearsā¦
I could take that pure Malawi and reincorporate the body high while increasing the potency and giving it a more skunk like nose.
I guarantee the trip will at least double in the cross.
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Yeah, ive talked with ace on icmag and they claim that its only Malawi sourced seeds and that the original genome had variation on leaflets. Probably would expect abit of dutch cross pollinating from before sourcing the beans.
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Ace Malawi was crossed to a pck early on when they couldnāt find a suitable male, then bred towards the Malawiā¦
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Haha thanks. Yeah typing isnāt exactly my favorite activity 
Iām not sure I understand what youāre askingā¦
The bx can be used to increase the frequency of some genes, useful to reinforce recessives.
Example from Sebring
Focusing only on the F2 generation we would get these results:
Pp x Pp (Big P is Dominant and p is recessive desired phenotype).
We get PP, Pp, Pp, pp with this combination, everywhere there is a big P the cross will have Dominant phenotype, in this case green buds. 75% green and 25% purple.
Mendel genetics states:
- P1+P2=F1 (filial cross)
- F1 =mostly Dominant traits
- F1+F1=F2 is where recessive genes show.
- So you can think F1= 100% Green, F2= 75% Green and 25% Purple
Combinations of this will be PP, Pp, pp
100% Dominant traits P= Green in 11 of 12 plants with purple only appearing in one plant.
So, P1+P2=F1 , then F1+F1=F2 would be unlikely to create the desired purple in a low number of plants in this situation, contrary to the way it did in Mendelās project.
Here is the solution to this problem:
P1 (Green) +P2 (Purple)=F1
F1+P2 (Purple)=Bc1
Bc1+F1=F2
F2+F2=F3
PP (P1) +pp (P2) = Pp,Pp,Pp,Pp (F1)
Pp (F1) + pp (P2) = Pp,Pp,pp,pp (Bc1) 50% purple phenotypes
pp (Bc1) + pp (Bc1) = pp, pp, pp, pp (F2) 100% purple phenotypes
This combination works with the advantage of higher recessive phenotype presence throughout the process while just seeking out Purple plants on a singular basis.
Pardon the lazy copy pasteā¦
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Thank you guys for the help beans arenāt the main focus for me but Iāll post about em on here if I end up trying (I have pollen paranoia-pollenoia) NL work, kushes, cheeses they just make me wanna splash some pollen around and see how beautifully stank the babies would be
Where did you source this information?
Iāll see if I still have the screenshotsā¦
The info comes from a defunct forum. Some people remember the old journals.
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Yes i was not thorough. I have an f5 wedding cake and an f5 florida Strawberriesā¦so ive crossed those and have the male.
Now im going back and grabbing females from those f5ās WC only and slamming them with that (wc f5 x fl.st.f5) f1 male. If you take into consideration the maths and percentages of homozygous f5āsā¦then mixed. If im right, you have something close to that wild s3 x s3 stuff. You get an f1 with only so many phenos availableā¦right? With the vigor, near heterozygous offspringā¦and no nasty chem sprays used. The downside is you have to take your lines to f5 first
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The issue with the purple is a trade-off, like mentioned above.
When the plants go purple theyāre no longer just producing chlorophyl to drive photosynthesis and production. Theyāre producing anthocyanins to protect against the incoming light radiation from further damaging the plant. Anthocyaninās canāt photosynthesize so thereās less capability for the plant to develop as there is just a lower amount of chlorophyl to do so.
If the leaves/buds turn red, then those areaās are no longer absorbing that spectrum of light. We know Red and Blue spectrums are important for photosynthesis, thatās why leaves are green. They donāt absorb green and take in red and blue. If they change colorās than theyāre no longer absorbing the new color. If that color is photosynthetically active, than the plant will be less able to produce. Green is not as efficient as red or blue.
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If my latest purple crosses donāt perform as I think they should, Iām probably going to leave them alone all together. The difference in the green versus the purple make the purples hardly worth the effort. Especially since I have green phenos that smell and taste just as good.
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I do hesitate to change my setup. Mostly in fear I wont be able to read my plants as well. I know the plants are very slowly acclimating to my environment. The normal stresses of everyday life are needed by the plant. Like the article of how plants respond to touch. Its not a simple fight or flight mechanism weāve related this to at times. They are very complex organsims, the combinations of stresses and environmental factors influence the plants can produce many pathways to the response of environmental changes experenced by the plant. To get a certain response by lst or hst it does help to have the right environment thats can be consistent while this is happening or it can result in a diverted response pathway that it normally would not take if the stressors were not present.
I am not focused on this nearly has much for the breeding as thatās really up to pairing genes. To find these genes consistently the environment needs to be consistent. So going back and hunting through beans to fix a breeding problem should require a reproduction of the original growing environment to be able to find the correct phenos takeing correct pathways. Or to change environment to make a different path maybe fixing the breeding problem, but again were pairing genes and maybe the parental selection was wrong so who knows what could fix the potential problem your unhappy with in the progeny.
https://www.nature.com/articles/465703a
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There should be fewer phenos popping in the f1 at that point, assuming the selected traits were locked in every gen.
I think the s3 x s3 is still more aggressive than the traditional f1 and can affect the general fitness of the line to a greater extent.
A 4 way cross (s3 x s3) x (s3 x s3) would do it proper. 
But I like variety in a line myself, so I tend not to breed too deep and run higher numbers.
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Im just gonna have to be known as one of those guys in the other camp. āNo spray joesā theyāll call us.
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