Got some “open pollination” Acapulco Gold" 16-24 weeks flower from MassMedical (so these are more less gathered in a field of plants they are subpost to be landrance/heirloom strain, in south america ?
Clture Tissue I know about but the other science "tripoid /polyoid = meani 3differnt “iods” compared to 2differernt “oids”(cells of strains)
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Interesting excerpt regarding triploidy. I knew that modern bananas were heavily influenced by human intervention, but didn’t know that it was the result of triploid propagation. Cool!
P.L. Pearson, in Encyclopedia of Genetics, 2001
*Other Organisms
Triploidy is encountered occasionally in natural populations of flowering plants containing diploid (2n) and tetraploid (4n) plants. It is presumed that such triploids arise by natural crosses between diploid and tetraploid plants in the same population. However, there are many examples of triploid strains of cultivated plants that have been induced artifically by crossing diploid and tetraploid parental strains. Unlike human triploids, such triploid plants appear to be morphologically normal, but are characterized by being completely infertile and can only be propagated vegetatively. Their infertility arises during gamete formation. Typically during meiosis the three homologs of each chromosome join and cross-over to produce a trivalent at the first meiotic division. The resulting chromosome segregation from each trivalent is completely random and it is extremely unlikely that a sufficiently large number of genetically balanced gametes can be produced to provide fertility. This phenomenon of triploid sterility was widely studied in the 1930s and 1940s in various plant species with notable contributions from Darlington and Mather in triploid Hyacinthus (hyacinth) and Dermen in Petunia by studying chromosome segregation in pollen.
One of the most famous and ancient examples of a triploid plant species is the cultivated banana characterized by its widely used and fleshy seedless fruit. The cultivated banana is believed to have been derived from a cross between a diploid species Musa acuminata and the tetraploid species M. balbisiana, both of which produce seeded fruit, some 1000 years ago in southeast Asia. This gave rise to a sterile triploid plant with large seedless fruit and enormous food-producing properties. Propagation of the cultivated banana occurs by dividing its root system. There are now more than 600 varieties of cultivated banana, including the plantain, which have been introduced into the majority of tropical countries. Although the original seeded wild species are still available, they are considered to be so inferior that they are only eaten in times of famine when the cultivated banana crop fails.
Modern plant breeders have adopted the same strategy of using the triploid status to produce seedless fruit for various fruit varieties of which currently the most important and fashionable ones are grapes, water-melons, and citrus fruits. Breeders have developed sophisticated methods of vegetative propagation including in vitro tissue culture and vegetative regeneration from endosperm tissue via somatic embryogenesis.
Although viable triploidy is rarely found in the animal kingdom, examples of natural newt populations were described the early 1940s in which triploids occurred together with diploid and tetraploid animals. In 1978 it was demonstrated that triploid newts could be induced experimentally by fertilizing heat-shocked eggs from diploid mothers; it was discovered that the heat shock treatment caused retention of the second polar body to produce a diploid egg. Similar strategies have been used to induce triploidy in fish for commercial reasons. Triploid salmon are sterile and demonstrate a steady and long-term growth combined with an improved flesh quality by comparison to fertile salmon and have a further advantage that they can be harvested at any time of the year. Triploid grass carp have been introduced into rivers and ponds in the United States for the purpose of weed control without the fear of reproduction and spreading in an uncontrolled fashion*
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Strawberries are octoploid, imagine how complicated breeding those would be. 
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Welcome to Jurassic park! 
Was curious about polyploid and if it was a recessive allele and how recessive traits become dominant and stumbled on this: Tools for Genetic Studies in Experimental Populations of Polyploids https://www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/fpls.2018.00513/full Pretty long read but fairly easy to follow. The references sited are about a third of the document.
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up until recently i have used the club pound on ground / chest thump, but mostly the plant that talks to me theory method and got decent / good results. i got a lot of ploid learning to do looks like. so then i i can think i know what i am doing? my head was spinning it was beyond me. i want to breed great strains myself. back when i was in my educations years a professor told me “the more you know about…the less you know of”, i have been trying to increase the “of” on growing this plant for a long time. i love all the “of” here on OG. thanks people.
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Hope they aren’t modified with frog DNA!
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believe it or not i was out wandering in the woods out back and i found a pot seed in amber goo stuff.lol
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I’m curious about this also. Though I think there is a subtle difference between finding better than mom (as I think transgressive segregation would have) and equal to mom, (ie, closest option to cloning)
But, does the process of selfing also produce its own transgressive segregation?
I’m inclined to think yes, but maybe to a reduced degree than m/f crossing.
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I would think it would definitely be possible, just due to the nature of meiosis and genetics.
I haven’t ran nor made any S1’s myself, but my understanding from a lot of reading is that you’re more likely to find the parents used to make the mom, than you are to see anything like the mom in S1’s. I think Nspecta said ~half of s1’s are trash and the other half will be good, with 10-15% chance for better… which sounds awfully close to the numbers for Transgressive Segregation 
At the same time, he said he dropped all his OG Kush cuts except for TK as he said he could pull out any of the OG Kush cuts from her S1’s… Seems like it’s up to the plant, which would come back to that General Combining Ability. Just because the plant looks the best, doesn’t mean it makes the best offspring. Sometimes two uglies make a pretty 
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Think of selfing as this. The genetics are in the mom like pool balls racked for a game of billiards. Then you self it (cueball). You will get to see what that mom has to offer. There won’t be this magical transgress cuz there isn’t a large gene pool to swing wildly in either direction as a normal cross.not enough alleles or gametes to go flopping around. Let’s see how long today until the troll haters hit me, im game for a little bit i guess, fun topic.
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10-15% would indicate a possible recessive reaction or that the resulting progeny that are desired require multiple alleles to meet the requirements for selection. I suppose a punnet square the produces 10-15% could reveal the number of genetic combinations based on phenotype?
Would transgressive segregation be a twisting of certain sections of DNA that recombines that are independent of the simple unzipping of the DNA strands and in a sense making simple Medellin inheritance void to some degree.
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Can this be part of the process that we are looking at…? Does this have any predictability and is it even part of the segregation process for I don’t know how often it occurs. Ahh maybe need to look into it more…?
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You’re hitting on that General or Specific Combining Ability. The ability of a particular cultivar to pass on its traits. Some traits are dominant, some are recessive, some are co-dominant, co-recessive, some need double recessive to show up. Some traits are tied to other traits and some aren’t. It’s up to you to see what’s in there and what is getting passed along, and direct that in a meaningful way to a better line.
A good portion of the “Elite Cuts” are one-off recessives that showed up in a stack of jane doe’s. Because of that, breeding with them doesn’t usually yield the same qualities as the parents due to not being able to double up on the recessive genes like the Elite has… ABC or Freakshow for instance, are recessive strains. If you cross an abc/freakshow into any other plant, you’re gonna get normal looking leaves in every single bean until you F2 them, then you’ll see those abc/freakshow leaves come out.
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Then going back to the segregation part, I am wondering if you are making f1’s to cross with f1’s to find the segregation in the f2’s; wouldn’t it be possible to self the f1 and look for segregation?
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Does it hold that transgressive segregation (tgs) is a recessive characteristic depending on the type being bred? What is dominant in one type might be recessive in another. Afghan dominates the Indica(Thai strain)?
When looking at the Afghan variety it is short bushy and has a CBD:THC of 1:1 and the Thai/Lao var Indica is THC:CBD 100:1. Thai are tall and high THC ratio which from observation is recessive to Afghan drug varieties?
Key Terms
- linkage: the property of genes of being inherited together
- recombination: the formation of genetic combinations in offspring that are not present in the parents
Is this what you would be describing HA?
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Linked Genes Violate the Law of Independent Assortment
Although all of Mendel’s pea characteristics behaved according to the law of independent assortment, we now know that some allele combinations are not inherited independently of each other. Genes that are located on separate non-homologous chromosomes will always sort independently. However, each chromosome contains hundreds or thousands of genes organized linearly on chromosomes like beads on a string. The segregation of alleles into gametes can be influenced by linkage, in which genes that are located physically close to each other on the same chromosome are more likely to be inherited as a pair. However, because of the process of recombination, or “crossover,” it is possible for two genes on the same chromosome to behave independently, or as if they are not linked. To understand this, let’s consider the biological basis of gene linkage and recombination.
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I have to correct you here, as an avid mutant cannabis aficionado! Some of the mutant strains currently known are XX-linked recessive. If a female mutant is used in the cross, the F1 males will all show some sign of abnormality. If you want to read more up on it, here’s a thread discussing it.
Very interesting stuff! Not like cannabis breeding isn’t it’s own world of craziness… let’s throw mutants into the mix. 
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i found this guy that is crazy smart on this stuff and i was talking to him about a ‘fast version’ project. It sort of applies to this topic so here’s what he says.
generally speaking hash cultivars will have a functional cbd synthase while sativa will not(it becomes a pseudo gene from non use) the main functional difference between sativa and indica is whether there is a functional cbd present. this is because theyve found that the 2 synthases are not on the same locus. meaning they will independently sort. its not a one or the other situation. so sativa(funtional thc/nonfuntional cbd) is the desired chemotype, but the possible chemotypes in a sativa x indica f2 are-
funtional thc/functionalcbd
functionalthc/nonfunctional cbd
nonfunctional thc/functional cbd
nonfunctional thc/nonfunctional cbd
cactus said “it is possible for two genes on the same chromosome to behave independently”
according to this guy, yes. but a selfed female will only show so much along the lines of abnormality. honestly i don’t like abnormal, except for novelty purposes. I want good whole vanilla genetics, all stable and slightly improved upon. This extreme pheno stuff is more for the cannabinoid/terpene profile more than “look at this mutation!” you want the plants’ profiles to be manipulated, not the leaf/stem/flower stuff. That’s why i posted the trifoliate/triploid. It’s in those polyploids you can get really fun, complex cannabinoid/terpene profiles. yes the 3 branches are cool looking, or the freakshow phenos, but what we want to stay focused on is the new exotic terpene and cannabinoid profiles we can get from breeding with these abnormalities.
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Now, i didnt suggest it was detrimental…just that the core benefit may have been forgotten about.
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You don’t do open pollenation if you want to isolate trats such as potency yield flavor and colors. Those traits are easier to lock down in a controlled pollenation of 2 known plants. Open =wild. Lot of variation. Different males hitting different females. Herms in field unnoticed and whoop there it is. A bunch of Acapulco going both ways and straight trash after 6months and herm babies (seeds) everywhere.
My personal opinion is Id rather have seed from plants that are known. Momma does this consistently so I’d hit her. With what? Either a chosen male or reversed known female. I’m a little lost on the topic. But I think it’s asking why open pollenation doesn’t provide the exact traits your trying to lock in.
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