Thank you! I consider that high praise.
1 Like
Yes, thatās called āgeotropismā and indeed plants like to grow up. Itās a vertical trellis, so indeed they grow up! Thereās another plant response at work called āphototropismā which is when the plant grows towards the light. I use this response to get the growing tips that will become buds to grow outward from the trellis.
Youāre absolutely right that this is a vertical version of the ScrOG technique; the main stem has been divided into several meristems, which are themselves divided into budding sites. Instead of flattening the plant horizontally, Iām doing it vertically which offers some advantages of better use of floor space, ease of access, a larger surface area for production and so on. This is about maximising yields, whether itās a closet or a warehouse. Size doesnāt matter as long as weāre talking about spaces bigger than a refrigerator box. In fact, bigger is better!
And how many rooms ARENāT rectangular? I would say relatively few. I used to work with round trellis panels and HPS or 860W CDM lamps. It was a bitch to work with them because there was little space inside and round trellis towers (I called them silos) donāt fit very well in rectangular rooms. This flat panel approach works soooooo much better.
1 Like
Any pics of your current setup?
This is a shot taken in veg at a project in involved in. Iāve called this my ācassetteā veg, where the panels are lit from the sides to encourage plants to fully fill out their panel edge to edge.
This is a pretty intense use of space; each of half a dozen panels is 48ftĀ² on both sides and they all fit within a footprint of less than 5ā x 10ā. The plant on the right is actually a spare with no trellis, so 7 plants are in that same space.
6 Likes
Nice! Imma make the vertical switch when I start back up. Suits the RDWC style better.
Have to fix a light. Replaced one of the ballasts after less than 3 years only for rhe other to crap out a month later. Only thing I can think of for the shortened lifespan is I drove them too hard. Does that sound likely to you?
1 Like
First issue is what kind of lighting and ballast is it exactly? Ballasts for HID differ widely based on wattage, type of ballast and type of lamp. Weāre not talking LED at all, right?
Second issue is that if youāre still using HID, that will affect what you can do with your vertical setup.
1 Like
Ballast is a meanwell 320H-24A. This is for LEDs. Was driving them to around 360w each.
These were purchased with Solstrips as part of a kit. Used less than 3 years so was odd they went. Though I did have a 240 go on my HLG kits at year 4 mark. They honored the warranty and sent me a replacement ballast.
The lights on the ballasts got really dim and occasionally didnt turn on so I replaced the ballast. Then a month later the other one started doing the same shit.
I have a couple 315w CMH ballasts almost twice the age and still running strong. Hell the first ballast i ever got a 600w digital for HID 10 years ago my cousin is using still.
1 Like
If it is OK to post a picture in your thread, sort of a half ass vertical. I did not bother to defoliate the lower branches and threw together two rows of lights to hit the area which would be shaded if the only light source was from above. Ended up with more usable bud.
There is also the plant at the end which I had a light shining on it that was vertical on a stand to do the same for the lower buds.
3 Likes
The only thing I can think of is some kind of power issue. Maybe loose wires in your house someplace or maybe the power company is doing something weird with the voltage?
I have some Chinese LED lights that are doing the same thing you described. Before I left HLG, we were thinking of using them as a supplier. Suffice to say it didnāt work out lol
Iām going to treat them apart and see if they can be fixed, otherwise Iāll be buying more drivers myself.
Anyone is more than welcome to post pics here!
I know several people who supplement their overhead lighting with side lighting as youāre doing. The more side light, the better up to the max the plants can take.
The vertical system Iām working on is really about space efficiency, access and ventilation. As you know, there are dead spots deep inside the canopy of a standard grow. Itās wasted space for cultivation and we growers know that itās a prime spot for mildew, rot and bugs.
The vertical panels and the training of the plants is meant to eliminate that dead spot so it isnāt wasting space and canāt harbor nasties. Additional benefits include top quality buds all the way down and excellent access for training and cultivating the plants. For instance, spraying them is a dream because itās all right in front of you!
2 Likes
I sort of expanded a open closet space into a mini-grow room and then expanded that once more. The opening to the closet is about four feet wide and I will probably be using it as a vertical grow area once I make up some more light rails. A lot more area to light face on than the roughly two foot depth of the space. I am going to have to increase my ventilation yet. Hope to just have the fan pull harder, need to cool the motor better though.
1 Like
Downside is hard to shield yourself from the bright lights. Usually i will enter my rooms with a hat on and that offers enough protection. I know most white light LEDs have neglible amounts of UV, but the bright lights still cant be good for the eyes when shining directly at you. Time either has to be squirrelled away before or after lights come on for training.
The benefits seem to far outweigh the cons. I will post my vertical setup once my rooms are up and running.
1 Like
I think one fan can keep up with your ventilation needs as long as itās pulling air out from the top of the closet and thereās space at the bottom for air to come in.
In such a tight space, you might consider putting a layer of white plastic on the wall, then setting up your trellis maybe 4" out from that, then setting your lights up 12-18" back from there. Mount your lights in such a way that they can be easily moved out of the way so you can access the trellis.
I highly recommend using some kind of fencing as the trellis panel and buying these things called āvine clipsā to attach branches to the trellis. Since I canāt imagine trying to move and entire trellis panel in and out of such a tight space (try it though, the benefits are week with it), youāll want to grow your plant elsewhere in veg and get it as tall as possible before putting it in the bloom space. Or maybe youāre vegging in your closet?
As the plants fill in the trellis, youāll want to position a fan so it blows air up between the trellis and the plastic. This will greatly help ventilation.
Consider putting each bank of your LED lights on a power strip with a switch. Then you can switch off the ones shining in your face while you work, leaving the ones behind you turned on. With double sided panels, this was a life saver for me! I can see what Iām doing a hell of a lot better, too.
1 Like
I did put white paper on the walls and have wire mesh (stucco I think) on strapping.
The closet opens up into a space about 4ā x 5ā. I need to make a proper bench for the two spaces where I flower the plants, as they grow I remove what they are sitting on or raise the lights. I do have the mesh on the walls for when I get serious about this. (meaning other things in life want attention also). I have other areas for veg that gets put in service when needed. Currently I am just recirculating the air into the house with the door open. The bottleneck is the size of duct I have coming out of the room which is dictated by the floor joists and other crap reducing what I can run. It is heating season and I am not using a humidifier for the house and it is a comfy 47% although it is going to get cold out and I will have to vent outside in the next day or so. I only have a 4" duct, I can up the airflow but I get more losses in pressure drop through the duct work. But you make do with what you have. The place is a work in progress.
1 Like
Welcome back! Iām up to speed now. What are the symptoms of the issue with the clones?
1 Like
It sounds like you have a handle on things. Let me know if I can help.
1 Like
Hey buddy! Thanks! The assumptions areā¦ They die lol
Theyāre fine for a week or so, then they turn yellow, then they die after 2-3 weeks. No roots.
1 Like
So nothing like mushy stems? Or wilted leaves? They just sit there and you canāt see any bumps or callus forming in the 2 weeks? Stems in or out of the water?
The stems turn to mush and the leaves wilt but only after a couple of weeks.
Iāve run them in an aerocloner and in soil and everybody died. Iāve lost some strains I didnāt want to let go.
1 Like