Diggy’s Dungeon

Foreword:
I’m trying a new format for this journal, I hope y’all feel free to correct any mistakes and misinformation you see, as I’m sure there’ll be a bunch here and there. :sweat_smile: :beers: :grin:
My journals always lack the specific info needed to paint a proper snapshot of the environment that created the phenotypes, so this time I’mma go in the opposite direction and try to paint only my perspective. The goal for this journal is to just dump the contents of my memory into a tangible format, that can be analyzed and criticized. Then rough hewn and whittled down to just the relevant facts, as I see them. If you’ll all join me in this little journey, I’d be glad to have you along.

Theoretical Day Zero.
So let’s say I’ve just decided I want to start some seeds. The oldest a little over a year, and the youngest, barely dry. I don’t like to keep any seeds longer than that because metabolism isn’t frozen inside of a seed — If you’ll allow a bit of an oversimplification — seeds are more like a hibernating bear, with finite nutrient stores. When they’re fresh, assuming an ample nutrient supply before winter arrived, the seeds should be large, plump, and full of nutrition. Small seeds can be linked to genetics, but it’s still the expectation of low nutrition that causes a cultivar to produce small seeds. In my experience, every plant, barring genetic anomalies, has the potential to produce big ol’ walnuts. This is important because size of the seed will be directly related to its longevity, and the larger seeds from a single harvest will, on average, produce larger healthier plants than smaller seeds from the same harvest.

If I’m worried about low germination rates from long periods of poor storage conditions, the first step is priming. You might have heard about gibberellic acids as the germination hormones, because it tells the plant to burn the stored sugars to fuel growth. The problem with this is it needs to be balanced with auxins and cytokinins, or you’ll throw the growth out of wack. Keep in mind that there are herbicides based on synthetic auxins, that effectively cause plants to grow themselves to death. In order to skip the guessing game of how much of each hormone to add, I tend to look to plant based PGRs when I use them — since a plant is unlikely to produce hormones in levels that would cause that plants death…

The addition (or not) of hormones is only part of the equation. The next variable in germination is water potential. I’m so confused by water potential that I’m barely able to speak on its existence. The jist of it is, water has a tendency to move from a place of higher concentration to a place of lower concentration, and the water potential is the speedometer. In old seeds we want to slow down the imbibition of water, so we don’t damage the cells as they wake up. I think of it like overfeeding a person whose been literally starving, and accidentally causing their death, simply by overloading the system. If you want to look into it more, osmotic priming / osmopriming is the term. I was told PEG is the usual method of controlling water potential, so barrier to entry is low in case you want to experiment with that option. If anyone is well-versed, I’d love to hear more about it.

Because my seeds are still young and supple, I tend to direct-sow. It drastically increases the chance of predation by bugs or pathogens, but it completely removes the risk of me crushing a seedling while transplanting it out of a paper-towel, or a bottle of water. They’re being sown in straight Massachusetts old-growth forest clay, cut with some rice hulls and perlite for aeration. Each seed is buried a little deeper than necessary, so that by the time the cotyledons break the surface the shell will be completely removed.

The last variable, excluding the obvious temperature requirements, is oxygen. If you look at any papers on the malting process, there is a point at which seeds will have absorbed all of the water that they need, and the seeds will be removed and left to dry for a number of hours. This is the point where germination has officially started, and metabolism has kicked into high-gear. The plant has just gone from its’ most durable form, to its’ absolute weakest, in a matter of hours.

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In order to properly paint a picture from my perspective, let’s randomly change subject in the middle of a project.

Silver Thiosulphate!


Absolutely Necessary:
Label your gallon of water, (B) and your small container (A)
(1 gallon / 4 liters) of distilled / RO water
1 container with a 500ml / 2 cup measure.
Funnel
Scale
Paper n pen. (Digital notes are for the birds.)


Step one is to weigh your container, whether it’s a shot glass, or a square of paper, or whatever suits your fancy. If your scale isn’t accurate to at least two places, get a different one.
Do not tare it out
Write down the weight of your container, and do the math on paper before you start.
.2grams Silver Nitrate
1.5grams Sodium Thiosulphate Pentahydrate

Dissolve .2g Silver Nitrate (A) into the 500ml of water;
Dissolve 1.5g Sodium Thiosulphate Pentahydrate (B) into the gallon.

When you’re satisfied they’ve dissolved;
pour the 500ml Silver Nitrate solution (A) back into the gallon of Sodium Thiosulphate (B) and mix thoroughly.


Stored out of direct light it should stay good for a hot minute. You’ll know when it starts to fall apart, when the silver particles turn the clear solution amber / brown. I’m not sure how long that takes exactly so I’m going to let this gallon be my measure.

Start spraying a sexually mature female ~at the flip to 12/12, and spray every five days until pollen is dropping. I’m still unsure of the best practices on spraying STS. A lot of people speak with a surety that I find curious. Controlling ethylene production seems more of an artform than a science, from my perspective.

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Hypothetical Day One

Somewhere between 18 and 36 hours the first seeds should be cracking, and as soon as the radicle touches the soil they start exchanging goods and information. The seeds are coated with bacteria, that in concert with the nutrient stores inside the seed, act sort of like the colostrum in milk. The loss of these is another factor in causing older seeds to have trouble germinating. In the best case scenario the newborn root will incorporate these lifeforms into, and between, its cells. Rhizophagy Irregularis is a fascinating example of a lifeform that the roots of our cannabis plants will literally eat, and then barf back out into the rhizosphere. There’s videos of it happening!

Another lifeform I like to have in my soil is trichoderma. It’s a predator, and it will consume your Rhizophagy if you let it. Simple solution is germinate the seeds in a sterile media, and add only Rhizophagy to the first few waterings. Once the plant has been established and had a little time to develop a relationship with Rhizophagy, the trichoderma’ and bacillus’ and PNSBs can be introduced without the risk of genocide.

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My brother Diggy… man, I so appreciate you taking me under your wing to teach me this. Plus sending the chemicals for our project. The seeds have been started.
Hoping to get a few mixes out of this.
I give my seeds 6wks min on plant to mature… you?
Does this work best spraying feminized plants, or any female?

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Lol. Careful. I’m much more of an Icarus than a Daedalus. I read incessantly, but I’ve little traditional training in anything. Standing on the shoulders of giants, and all that.

There should be no difference at all. The silver blocks ethylene production, and being feminized or not should be unrelated to the plants natural ethylene levels.

Some people are against breeding with feminized plants, but it’s because they don’t distinguish between methods of producing feminized seeds. If you’ve heard of Soma’s Rodelization, it’s the practice of letting a female plant hermie due to stress, and then collecting that pollen to make feminized seeds. The problem is because the parent plant hermied under normal conditions, the babies will be feminized, but all of their babies will hermie, too. It definitely works, but it’s like putting out a fire with a grenade.

By using silver — especially if we’re using proven moms that we know don’t herm under normal conditions — There is no trigger available to turn the babies into hermies.

The next big advancement in feminized seeds will be figuring out how to control hormone levels in autoflowers to keep them in veg indefinitely. That way we can clone em and stress test the clones, before choosing who to breed with.

Last, thank you for your time, brother. I truly appreciate it.

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An excellent explanation of the different methods of creating feminized seed. :+1::seedling:

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I’ll be glad to post up the progress here on this project… Could wind up being a nice tutorial…

I love this kind of sharing and caring… and how this wonderful plant brings us all together…

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Rhetorical Day Four

There’s this fun period between 36 and 120 hours, after wetting, where all of the seeds should have germinated but none have broken the surface. I’m pretty good these days about not worrying. But I still think;
Did they get enough water?
Do they need more?
Are they warm enough?
Oh, dear god, are they too warm?!?
What if they never germinate!?!
Lmfao.
To quote Killer Mike “Even if some good ones die, fuck it, the lord will sort em.” I sprayed em only once — with about an oz of water for each 16oz cup — and then more or less just leave the tf alone until day five, when I’ll spray em with another oz each.

I swear I had a point to this post before I started writing… Idk, let’s go on a tangent and see where we end up. Lol. This run was supposed to be a test of the 2020 and ‘21 Boxes of Chocolates, to help spur interest in the project, but I really don’t need more sinsemilla. I need to be productive, if only for mental healths’ sake. So two birds with one stone, I’m teaching my cousin how to grow using a clone of @Carty ’s Gorilla Glue, 8 Gorilla Glue RIL seeds from @Tonygreen , and 4 White Truffle S1 seeds (Peanut Butter Breath x Gorilla Glue) from Beleaf.

If I win a mil on a scratch ticket, or find a backpack full of cash, I’mma cop the legit clone of White Truffle from this dude DemonTrich on strainly, and Bx an S1. Short of that, reversing an RIL and making femmes with an S1 seems like a quick way to an end result that would ingratiate a large population.

There’s two types of breeding that really pique my interests — blowing up small populations to see what’s inside; and bringing distant relatives back together again. Especially in this case, making (Gorilla Glue x Gorilla Bubble) x (Gorilla Glue x Peanut Butter Breath) feels like cheating. If I called myself a breeder, I would be a little ashamed to piggyback on so many people’s work. But I’m not a breeder. If I needed a title I think calling myself a Curator might be the most accurate. I just like sharing the things that I enjoy, in the hopes that others might as well

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Haha love the selection of the person to quote.

“More G’s on me, than a late 80’s Gucci leather worn by the great Rakim himself”

The pre Run the Jewels days were the best imo. Going to be following along here :v:t2:

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The more I talk with you, the more I want to cut my ties with all others offering me free seeds for their own exposure. After growing these few from WSE I will do just that. I’d like to stay dedicated to what we have going. I love what I read in you sir.
And never worry about rambling on, I read it all like u…
I dig what you stand for, I’m no breeder but a pollen chucker… step down from you. Lol.

Consider me in my brother diggy…

And apologies for getting side tracked…

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So as I water my seedlings I hear you in my head… yup, we are both anal about our babies.
because I water mine with a little squeeze thing used for removing snot from a babies nose.
but, dam it if doesn’t work perfect allowing me to place the water exactly where I want it… about 2" away from stem. And, just starting your Upzallberry Autos with no germination… that is when I hear you… are they wet enough??? hehe.

Appreciate all the love, gonna have to SCALE things up… all arrived safe buddy…

Do you have any other Auto’s ?

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At the moment? Nada. Using the same batch of seeds to flip a couple photo lines, tho. I’m doing these Massachusetts Super Skunks, and a friend is flipping some Blackberry Breath.

There was another auto project going, but the entire batch tripped, fell, and landed in my blender. The name Upzalberries is what I was calling that line, too. It’s just a placeholder to keep from having to recite the lineage when referring to em.

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Massachusetts Super Skunk F4 officially pollinated.

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Just had to ask…hehe. I do have a nice auto called Blue Himalayan you might want to check out Diggy… and the good part, I can send you 50 or 100 seeds of it giving you enough to go thru things and decide if you can find a keeper. She’s a beast and good smoke. My seed partner in AZ, ZeroZero who is helping with the feminizing project made these at my request 5yrs ago…

I’ll see if I can find a photo of her ok…

I have 2 Upzalberry up and running and ZeroZero has 12 up and going… I did mine like we talked about, no germination, just dropped in dirt and kept moist… 3 days… nice huh.



yay, babies… cheers bro

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I’d be down with that. I could start the whole batch on 4/20/22, and have them all documented, proper.

Ma.SS, ~Creeping up on four weeks into flower.
One week since pollination, now, and they’re filling back in with new viable pistils.


Sister A) Happy, happy.
Sister B) Little Potassium burn. Maybe a dry spot in the soil?

There should be like 4-6 seeds per gram. What’s the halfway point between Sinsemilla and absolutely flooded with seeds? Semisemilla? :joy:

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Logically, it works. Sin means without, so… why not? Maybe Consemilla?

So I guess seeds fly ALL over here in the winter? I became active in april / may, and its been lots of free seeds from peeps, but maybe its me but right now I am seeing LOTS of people pollenating and plenty of seeds being made, more so than in the summer / spring for sure… Shit, I can’t wait to share some of my own creations :smiley: lol

I can only imagine whats in store if everybodys pollenations are as successful as mine was :smiley: And mine wasn’t anything to brag about :rofl:

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Hell yeah. All things go according to plan; the first ~800 or so seeds should be in a few dozen stockings, on Christmas mornin.
(forgot to post whole plant shots.)


Also, I always have some sort of unusual companion plant in the pots. Not so much for any (real, or imaginary) allelopathy, but because I like not watering extra pots
So far, besides the ordinary things like Clovers and Barley, I’ve had: Marigolds; Collards; Morning Glories; and Lettuce. Garlic and Lentils in particular both tend to behave themselves.

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Technically Day 33
Pollinated twice during the fourth week of flower, and then the male was removed. There’s still new white pistils poppin so it’s a pretty good bet they weren’t over-pollinated, and all the seeds will fully ripen.




I don’t understand the seed development and maturation process very well… It’s independent of light schedule!?!
I have so many questions…
:face_with_raised_eyebrow: :upside_down_face: :confused: :upside_down_face: :face_with_raised_eyebrow:
Welp. My understanding of reality holds no bearing on it, so no use pondering it in absence of an expert.

What matters is we can increase DLI in seed-bearing plants beyond that of normal flowering for sinsemilla, even if we’re already pushing the limits of PPFD, by cutting our dark period.

Why would we want to do that? Aren’t the plants going to try to reveg and turn the flowers to trash? Yup! But more photosynthesis plus fewer hours of darkness, keeps more sugars in the plant, giving us larger seeds. This is important to me because the seed stock these plants came from was consistently incredibly small, even though they were nice and dark, and clearly mature seeds.

I’ve successfully harvested seeds from moms pollinated in veg, and shortened the dark period of plants in their last couple weeks of flower. But never tried adjusting the light schedule a week after pollination, in the middle of flower, tho, so we’re treading new waters. I’ll take pics weekly to see how they transform.

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Stacking nicely :ok_hand:

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Definitely worth listening to in the background as you work.

Couple thoughts:

  1. Open pollination; might be a good rule of thumb that this be the first step in every breeding project. Can’t go backwards after you’re bottlenecked.

  2. Bulk Selection; Used to quickly acclimate a line to your environment, by letting natural selection drive for the first few generations, and selecting the best individuals to continue from a >F5 generation.

  3. Single Seed Descent; Decide the maximum number of plants you would like to run, divide by 3, and you have (x).
    Take two clones from (x) number of plants in your F2 generation, reverse one of each, and make (x) number of S1 generations.
    Grow one seed from every batch of S1s, and take two clones from each and every one of those. Reverse (x) number of clones and make (x) number of S2 generations.
    Grow one seed from every batch of S2s, and take two clones from each of those. Reverse one, impregnate the other. Now that you have (x) number of S3s, you’re almost halfway done. Rinse and repeat up until S6 before starting your selections, and progeny testing. If you thought the description was tedious, imagine the practice. :grin:

(Need to add more to this)

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