Does conventional breeding and filial notation apply to today's polyhybrids?

Breeder's Lab
#8

i had to look them up so i’ve included the definitions below for anyone else that’s curious. i still don’t really understand lol.

Heterozygous

Definition
adjective
(1) Of, or pertaining to an individual (or a condition in a cell or an organism) containing two different alleles for a particular trait.
(2) Having dissimilar alleles that code for the same gene or trait.

and

Homozygous

Definition
adjective
(1) Of, or pertaining to an individual (or a condition in a cell or an organism) containing two copies of the same allele for a particular trait located at similar positions (loci) on paired chromosomes (see homologous chromosomes).
(2) Having two identical alleles that code for the same trait.

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#9

The alleles are the possible characteristics, let’s use only hair color, for simplicity.

If there are two different alleles for the same trait -maybe one produces red hairs, and the other produces orange hairs - there are (at least) two possible expressions. That’s heterozygous.

If there’s only one allele available for hair color, the entire line will true breed for that characteristic. Than its homozygous.

Of course real life is much more complicated, and sometimes traits are linked to others… But that’s beyond my comprehension

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#10

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#11

Hey @oleskool830

Your kitty has something stinky on its paw, lol.

99

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#12

Lolololol! Hope you’re well and lifted my friend.
:cowboy_hat_face:

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#13

I’ll apologize b4 hand i think in extremes. Yet your saying is that the single factor of breeding with a poly has negative effect on genealogy? Is that bc of the human intervention of selective breeding? Or we talking nazi pure blood is the ultimate race kinda thing? Obviously you need selective breeding bc otherwise they’ll revert back to herm eventually. And if the time is taken to pick good breeding stock how is that negative, under any circumstances. I think hybrid vigor in of itself is proof that it’s positive. I’ve been graced the chance to grow a strain that a family ibl’ed since the early 70’s and it was fantastic. Yet it didn’t cook me breakfast n give me a knober after. Weather indica sativa or a mix all cannabis matters.

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Seed Run Co-Op Bodhi F2 TE Remix
#14

Polyhybrids just take more work. When it comes down to it its simply section selection selection.
Anything can be made true breeding with time, but selecting polyhybrid with more common ancestry gets you their quicker.

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#15

What?

I don’t understand what your even trying to get at

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#16

Detrimental to the well-being or survival of the plant. No.

Detrimental to the market? When we have thirty five different names for the genetics that are OGKush, and on the other hand, thirty five different buds all with the same name? I think so.

Edit: I’m not against polyhybrids, I’m against polyhybridizing polyhybrids. There needs to be some work put in to ensure the seeds express the characteristics that are advertised. We wouldn’t accept a package of “white eggplant seeds” that produces white eggplants only once in a while, or Romanesco broccoli that may or may not produce Romanesco broccoli, depending on whether you purchased enough packs to find that “keeper broccoli plant”

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#17

Agreed and considering that all 35 are likely the same plant under different growing conditions.
Its like buying a stud akc German shepherd and breeding to your registered female and getting puppies that look slightly different, thinking you got shafted.
If the plants aren’t identicle twins everyone screams pheno hunt.

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#18

Killer dude I’ve been on a kick about that for a while.
We need to get in line with the veggie breeders and get Serious about this stuff.
If I’m growing tga the void then interbreed them I should get something relatively close to tga the void, or white widow or purple punch. Not just a bunch of random plants.
I ran into this with mycoteck 413 chem 5 seeds planted 5 drastically different plants like indica, sativa, ruderalis, drastic. Polyhybrids bred with polyhybrids. So if a seasoned tomato gardener wants to get into cannabis and runs into this he’s gonna work the strain and blow its breeder out of the water. I guess it goes both ways.

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#19

I’m saying good bud is just that. How you get their isn’t an issue imo.

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#20

Bananas are a great example of how well standardization can work. Maybe it’s the black sheep in me but any talk of uniform makes me cringe.

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#21

This is the point. These days it seems anyone with 2 tents and a dozen seeds present themselves as “breeders”. This is most evident in places like IG and FB. What is the standard?

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#22

To get my big Sioux Roma tomatoes a little sweeter for tomato paste type recipes took 3 rows (@40 plants) and three full growing seasons.
With cannabis you have the advantage of indoor and a lot faster seasons (3 to 4 months including seed drying I think) but as said by Greg green and a few others, 25 plants minimum for decent selection.

I’d say if I’m buying these seeds at premium pricing, I’m expecting a breeder to have at least 50 plants with a minimum of f4 and an f5 test run.
2 to 3 years for a new strain???
Sounds brutal, but to me if I’m paying 100 bucks a pack or more that would be a bare minimum in effort.
Those times get cut down if you’re working with two stable strains but crossing two drastically different polyhybrids would likely double that.
I’m no expert by any means and a cannabis begginer in my estimation so correct me if I’m wrong.

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#23

I think this is where @Skiball thoughts come into play, and its the driving force behind most seed sales nowadays.
Pollen chuckers can produce a legitimate product that deserves a place in the market.
And some breeders spend years on a project that isn’t worth the time they put in.

(Off topic: Your big Sioux Roma tomatoes are sticking in my mind like bad pop music, lmao. Been far too long since I’ve had a garden fresh tomato. Store-bought is a sick joke.)

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#24

Well said! My feelings exactly! There should be some standards by which one can make an informed purchase when paying $60 - $100 a pack. It’s like “rolling the dice” every time.

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#25

a canadian grower was issued breeders rights for a sativa strain named ‘Big C’ so it must have been a stable and unique strain. breeders rights (or varietal rights) is like a patent or copyright. it must be new, distinct, uniform, and stable.

https://news.lift.co/canada-copyright-cannabis/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plant_breeders’_rights

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#26

Interesting that a “Chris Griffin” who attended the University of Toronto also happens to work at the CFIA.

https://ca.linkedin.com/in/chris-griffin-b7599491

They cheer legalization, but force corporatization.

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#27

wow it’s probably the same guy too, friggin swindlers and crooks the whole government n their cannabis industry.

i think its super cool when breeders state the filial generation on their packages (like @LED_Seedz) there’s some companies which i don’t even think test or run their gear themselves, they just hit a female with their male and release the seeds immediately

the phylos galaxy is super cool, its a big interactive map of all the genetics in their database (the public data anyways) and you can see common links and connections between different strains. there really needs to be some standardization in cannabis industry. but at least phylos could likely confirm if what you have is actually what you think you have etc.

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