Landraces and heirloom (Part 1)

Does anyone here remember the old breedbay seed auctions?
That’s where bodhi got started selling his seeds.

There was a really awesome old collector on breedbay called Pakasymbiot who sold seeds as entheogen seeds. He had some amazing stuff he collected during his epic backpacking expeditions.

I contacted him, and was about to buy some of his lines through the auction. Then breedbay went dark for about 2 years. They are back now, but the seed auction is gone. I don’t think Pakasymbiot ever showed up again, I hope he’s ok.

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just got this

Hi Dequilo,

When I list seeds as S1 that means that I pollinated the female with a male of the same strain, so yes they are “selfed.” All seeds are regular, so you’ll get males and females when you grow them.

The seeds you want are available, they are F1s and they are regular.

All seeds are a $25 donation for a pack of 20. Send your donation to my address below. Currently I’m only accepting cash donations. Include $10 for shipping. Include in the letter what seeds you want and how many packs of each, your email address, and the address you want your seeds shipped to. When you send your donation, email me with the tracking number. When I receive your donation I’ll ship out your seeds and email you with a tracking number for your order. I include freebies with every order based on what you ordered and/or what I think you might like.

so I will send him some bucks and go from there

Dequilo

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‘Maybe you need to read “How to Argue with a Racist,” so we can begin to de-program your internalized racism and bring you back to a more moral and less hateful existence. Your use of the word landrace is a macro-aggression. If you disagree, you need to read the book mentioned above. If you still disagree, just keep reading the book until you do.’ That is discourse to these people. They consider that ‘dialog’. Imagine a person like that in absolute power for a second. It’s enough to send shivers down the spine.

Poison. These people are pure poison. Bored, bourgeoisie white people with zero perspective, authenticity, or intellect impeding actual progress and discourse. The truly baffling thing about all this mess is how little shame they feel. I don’t think they are capable of seeing the missteps in reasoning that led them to their positions. They just double down when cognitive dissonance creeps its ugly head in. I hope their dead-end ideas betray them soon enough so all that remains is the empty husk of vapid human existence they became when they abandoned critical thought in favor of sophistry, bullying, and the absolute primacy of group identity.

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that got me on both of the crosses :slight_smile: grown in Vermont my next door neighbor

I got a C99 mix calling it if I find a good female

all the best

Dequilo

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@dequilo very interested in what happens here… will be watching!

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I have been banned from his IG. Dont even know what I did. I Probably recommended someone elses landrace if he was out of stock, or like you said, dared to disagree. Too bad. I like his seeds. I think hes been on icmag too much. Lots of knowledgeable folks over there, but there are often rude and disrespectful comments.

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Lol. Wouldnt that be nice! Yup. People have gone too far. Im a nice person, and hate no one, but feel i have to walk on eggshells all the time. People should be who they are period. If someone has a problem with that, F@#k em.
There is only one quality I look for in people, and that’s whether they are a good person or not. Thats all that matters in the end.

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My God @Eudaemon. I wish I could write like you do. Pure poetry. You have a gift to be able to put down thoughts so eloquently.
@dequilo … I would love to get a hold of his oaxacan, but I have a feeling he will never sell it. Have you seen the size of the buds it produces? Absolutely massive and to grow in Massachusetts without mold is truly something special. Not sure if you read how he used to grow in between the highway Lanes, using a culvert for access. A man after my own heart. I had a spot on I-88 scoped out for about a decade, but never did use it. I planned to access it through a culvert. The fact that it was a guerrilla grown( oh Lord, is this offensive to gorillas? Lol)variety means it is probably pretty damn bomb-proof when it comes to pests, molds and other issues outdoor growers in the Northeast would see. It is one thing to grow a potent plant, but quite another to harvest one. The Northeast requires that resin glands be pretty damn tough to withstand the beating they receive from rain storms around Harvest Time without exploding or falling apart.

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@Upstate I was just going to send him bucks but wanted to ask about the Purple Satellite uncrossed

so i shot him an email and got right back to me

he has them for the same deal 20 for 25 dollars

so we will see

Dequilo

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It sure looks like a good one. Really pretty plants too. One thing’s for sure, and that is that you will do them some justice. That purple satellite I think is an F1 hybrid. Make some seeds off of it, pass a few out, and in a couple years somebody will find something that very closely represents his oaxacan.

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To my mind, it is very important to be as precise as possible in new language, and sociological studies will bear out the importance of language on perception.
For instance persons cannot be “legal” or “illegal” at last not in a democratic and just or ‘liberal’ society. All democracies are liberal in this sense. Non autocratic governments are liberal whether conservative or progressive, in fact they should have elements that are in each camp to function properly.
By the same token,. A person is not “retarded” but may be developmentally delayed, in the autism spectrum, have a learning disability or emotional disturbance. Yet the disability should not be used to define them.
It’s not necessary to get offended or “on your high horse,” when pointing this out…and I’m hoping I do not come across that way.
Academic circles are very tough in this kind of specificity and this is where some of the ego boosting nonsense arises I am sure. As someone who works with the special education population, I find that I’m come down as conservative on some issues and liberal in others. No label or diagnosis should ever be used to define people, as it becomes a shortcut or stereotype and will lead to poor decisions regarding their need of support or care. I have not seen the trope against the term landrace but it seems we all need to chill… Maybe we can learn better ways to define the strains or varieties of cannabis we are talking about in order to become more precise in our definitions…thus more precise in our thoughts.

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Precision is hugely important in language. It isn’t important, though, when definitions are arbitrarily created without consensus, common usage, or governing body behind them. The social sciences is notorious for this. Equity versus equality is a big one. There is no etymological basis for a differentiation between the words. Yet somehow–very recently–they have two very different meanings in the social sciences, and that meaning now extends to society at large? Why? What was the process behind that? The continually morphing definition of the word ‘racism’ is another one. Is it institutional or individual? Adding more definitions to a word, by design, makes language less precise; adding new words increases specificity, broadening definitions does the opposite. Take the word violence, for example: that single word is now used to describe at least a half a dozen different concepts in the social justice movement. The same goes for the word power. These linguistic changes have no etymological or consensus usage basis. These are all arbitrarily created by one small segment of academia.

There is absolutely no way anyone that follows the social justice movement can claim it is about precision of language. Nor are virtually any of the positions and arguments deductively valid.

Of all the linguistic crusades that the social justice movement undertakes, this one bothers me the least. Language and perception have a lot of impact. I think changing the language makes logical sense and adds to precision of language, since we’re not simply broadening definitions, we’re narrowing them and adding more specificity.

That’s literally what retarded means, developmentally delayed. They used to call them idiots and morons, literally, so they developed the more politically correct and scientific word, “retarded,” which comes from the verb to retard, which means… to slow. It became a bad word because people used it as an insult… because we as a society view people with mental handicaps as less than human. Developmentally delayed doesn’t quite roll off the tongue like retarded, but I am sure the kids will be using these newly minted, ‘respectful’ words as insults soon enough. This isn’t rocket science. You can look at the etymological history of most of the insults we use today and they are often yesterday’s politically correct words. It is a never-ending cycle of cancer that erodes and impedes the natural, healthy evolution of language, and subsequently thought, that occurs with it.

I hope I don’t come off as hostile or too aggressive. My tone can get a bit ‘bombastic’ on these topics. I know these people generally mean well.

Edit: And the illogical demonization of language is terrifying, as well. The word niggardly is off-limits, despite having an entirely different Latin root. ‘Landrace’ now is off-limits. You can’t use the verb retard anymore. It very much comes off as a war on thought and expression at that point.

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I don’t think the issue is that far removed from what you are saying, I would only point out the term"Retard" as a slur is used in almost anyone with neurological differences.
Therefore generalization is the result and damaging as such.
As far as one small segment of academia, those are the fields who deal with the issue from a scientific basis. For instance I learned quickly not to refer to a child as an “Autistic child”…when I entered this field of academia. A child may be in the autism spectrum but is not defined by their diagnosis. This keeps those who work with the child from generalization about the child’s condition or abilities.
Those who are in the field determine the way terms are used, that may be right or wrong but it’s a part of the academia I like the least…but it is what it is.
Now…adding and broadening terms is another problem. I agree this is a difficult area.
However, in this case, and not speaking of the SJW movement but int he definition of landrace, I see no reason why some can’t use their position to introduce more precision into he definition of cannabis strains. Again I didn’t read the post, real seed company still refers to some strains as landraces on their website so I guess I’m not sure about this entire hubub.

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As some one diagnosed with Asperger’s, I was furious when they took my label away from me. Now I’m ‘on the spectrum’. Now, as adults, we call ourselves autists because it is an integral part of our identity, because society doesn’t actually value us as people and the manner in which we interface with the world. It is as clear as day–from the minute we enter the system–we see it for the thresher it is, waiting to swallow us whole. For the more high functioning of us, that identity is something we cling onto, since society doesn’t give us much else. I will caveat that by saying I have noticed this attitude becomes less prevalent as you travel down the ladder of functionality.

Simply changing the language from “Autistic Child,” to “Child that resides somewhere on the spectrum,” doesn’t actually change how horrendous and crushing our education system is for autistic children; that’s the fault of the social scientists that created and guided the system, the thresher.

That’s the big lie that they’re selling everyone. They don’t deal with this issue from a scientific basis. There is absolutely zero scientific rigor to what they do. They present their ‘research’ and ‘data’ as if the social sciences were a hard science with clear, objective truth. Does it seem like they operate with scientific rigor? Does it seem like the scientific method is the social sciences guiding principle?

Even the hard sciences are wrong most of the time. The moral authority from which the social scientists and social justice advocates preach should alarm anyone. It’s very alarming to everyone in the hard science community. None of this is how science works.

Edit: And in the end, this derailment of discussion is The Real Seed Co.'s contribution. This division, anger, angst, and politicization that they’ve tossed into the cannabis community and this thread like a hand grenade. They’ve done the exact thing they claim to want to resolve. Imagine if they had never raised this issue, would the community be better or worse? Does eliminating the word landrace have any functional impact in human race relations in the fractionally small off-chance they were successful?

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Yes, it is quite possible that changing the language changes persons behavior. As a fifteen year veteran teacher and twenty years in sales I can promise you words make people’s reactions. In fact I’m sure changing the language changes behavior. As far as Angus goes, he didn’t insert himself into this thread, someone else did and then others made it political. That’s a shame.

Good points both of you. No offense meant to anybody, but I will continue to use the word landrace. If someone has a problem with that one, I don’t care. Their problem not mine. At one point enough has to be enough. When will it end? When we are no longer able to speak because any word that we use will be offensive to somebody? If somebody has a mental handicap, do your part by not calling attention to it. That’s what all of us can do. I agree that new terms will just create new derogatory terms. It just happens. I’m happy the public is creating awareness about how the way the world is and how things are perceived, and they need to change, But I think we are making too big a deal out of things when we should be making less of it. We should be teaching that it’s not a big deal for someone to be different, yet instead we are differentiating everyone with labels and making a big deal out of it. We should be teaching that we are all the same. Its just two different philosophies on tackling the same thing. My cousins son is Autistic and gay. To me he is just “name”. I told him to just be himself no matter what and don’t make a big deal out of it and others won’t make a big deal about it. You’ve never seen someone like him with more friends. He’s not “this or that”. He just" is". Titles don’t define him, he does.
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There is no racism in this definition. What’s next on the hit list? Is the human race now offensive?
Its just gone too far, and we have to put our foot down and say no more. It’s only dividing us, not making us stronger, and I tend to think the puppet master pulling the strings has this intent to begin with. To divide us so we are weak.

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Amen. Whenever people start to realize how broken the systems are and begin demanding broad, sweeping institutional change, notice how the media starts to play the identity politics drum. They are playing us like fiddles so they can rob us blind.

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I agree, ICmag has a wealth of knowledge but it is strife with trolls/negative energy. That’s a shame he felt he needed to block you from RSC IG, as you said it was probably nothing sinister on your part but he just took it the wrong way. I’m sure you could still buy his seeds but that’s only if you WANT to. Hopefully with time Angus chills out a bit more and stops with the crusades, for now i’m going to stay away from his social accounts so i don’t get involved and cause myself some unnecessary trouble :+1:

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I highly recommend this essay discussing Essentialism and the social justice movement’s disturbing obsession with language:

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Great article. Funny enough, when I was in school, kids started applying categories to themselves as a reaction to this, and unfortunately, I don’t think it’s changed today.

it posits that there is some essential essence to each of the (socially constructed!) racial categories extant in society, and that this essence is the principal determinant of who we are, what our experiences are, and what we think. Yet just as there is no “bedness”, so too is there no “whiteness” “blackness” or “Asianness” (Asianity?), because we are not defined by our race, we are individuals. When we pin meaning onto these empty racial labels, that is itself racism.

Furthermore, this focus on categories is what makes identity politics so spiteful and dehumanising. If one assumes that things have an essential essence, one also assumes that things differ only because their essential essence is different.

It goes way beyond race. When I was in school, it was almost comical that some kid would show up wearing different clothes and say “I am goth”. Yet we don’t find the same ridiculousness when someone says “I am Republican” or “I am Democrat”.

Yet it is because these concepts are so abstract – so uncoupled from any grounding in reality – that they can become so powerful in people’s minds. Without any way to check if they are true, there also is no good way to show these assertions to be false, meaning activists can rage and rage against something that is nothing more than an idea in their head.

Indeed, it is only by this single-minded focus on the idea of another’s race that someone can stop seeing them as an individual human being. Sadly, millions of years of evolution have made humans very good at being tribal; we have an in-group and an out-group, and we are all too adept at convincing ourselves that the out-group is inherently evil, dangerous or other. Essentialist thinking facilitates this hugely because it encourages us to see people as representing an abstract idea associated with their group rather than as an individual human; one who you might otherwise have had a beer or a cup of tea with. It takes a truly powerful mental image to hate someone that you have never met.

Sound familiar? Registration to a political party is the new racism. Now watch this.

Indeed, it is only by this single-minded focus on the idea of another’s political affiliation that someone can stop seeing them as an individual human being. Sadly, millions of years of evolution have made humans very good at being tribal; we have an in-group and an out-group, and we are all too adept at convincing ourselves that the out-group is inherently evil, dangerous or other. Essentialist thinking facilitates this hugely because it encourages us to see people as representing an abstract idea associated with their group rather than as an individual human; one who you might otherwise have had a beer or a cup of tea with. It takes a truly powerful mental image to hate someone that you have never met.

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