So I got a bag from my local dispensary of purple panty dropper that was discounted for seeds in it couple years ago. Well I grew em out and kept the only female at the time( had 3 other males as well in a completely different space) and stressed out the girl to get selfed seeds creating an s1 from her. As for the males I let them get to a point of dropping pollen and at that point killed, plucked fan leaves, dried, and stripped the stems of everything plant matter left and threw it all in a bag and storing in a cooler dark dry place. I have an s1 going of it from the resulting seed as well as another female from the original seed from the bag I got the strain out of. The males and females I’ve observed from these lines all appear to be very consistent and uniform with each other so my question is without having any info about the breeder and their work, how would I know if they are IBL? Since I got em as an unknown would I call the generation first recieved an F1 still even though there is indications this strain has been worked with and stablized? If I were to take the pollen I saved from the males and throw it at the “F1” generation plant would that put me to an f2 or just continuing work with an IBL? With the s1 plant I created what would it be considered crossing with “F1” pollen and would it just give me a bx with a 75/25 ratio of f/m since Id be reintroducing the male chromosome back into the genepool? It’s been an incredible strain to grow and enjoy and really considering doing a good seed run of the remnants of the plants that got fried but still have a couple branches left for strain preservation
That’s out of my scope of expertise. If you like the females and have male pollen stored seed a plant see what you end up with. Should be good I’d say.
You’re too humble @ShiskaberrySavior, you’re a guru in my eyes bro.
I could try to give you an answer @anon92380848, but I’m almost positive someone would come along and prove me wrong real quick 
Hey @DannyTerpintine , @lefthandseeds , @SamwellBB , can you gentlemen take a look at this thread please 
I guess the purpose of the question is to have a better understanding of what to expect as my ultimate goal is to try to get this wonderful strain in the hands of others as a stable IBL to work into other strains. the original parents are a cross of( mutanuskan mist x purple haze x Oregon grape) from the research I did on it and in my 10 years in the game have only came across this the single time at my local dispo. Strain has a unique " aphrodisiac" effect that I can attest to and think it has a lot of potential getting in the hands of other breeders to work into some of their lines but my goal is to make sure I perfected an IBL and have fem and regular seeds on hand that are stable of it before throwing other genetics in it’s genepool
Hey bud, I won’t even open my mouth about this stuff, I am still the new guy. That said the 3 guys I tag can likely answer your questions accurately. There are many others but I don’t think you will need them.
It’s hard to say anything definitive without knowing the breeder and specifically what the dispensary is growing. But I’d say it’s unlikely to be an IBL.
Biggest reason is that dispensary growers I know don’t like to grow IBLs because first gen hybrids and polyhybrids tend to have better vigor. Second is that hardly anything modern that is composed of more than 2 old IBLs is even a true F1. People simply aren’t breeding IBLs anymore. It’s rare to find them, although I have seen a few strains from about 20-25 years being sold that are getting close. But the vast majority of things in dispensaries and on the seed market are polyhybrids.
So many questions. Will comment with a clear head in the morning.
So since it’s a three way cross it’s not really possible to make an IBL? I def wouldn’t say this is a vigorous growth strain compared to others I’ve grown so mentioning that as well along with the uniform shape of the leaves, same internodal spacing, red leaf stems, etc makes me feel like there has been some attempts at stabilization, at least really not much appearance difference between my s1 generation and popping one of the original bean out of the same sack or the previous female my s1 seeds came from and the males. So at best what am I considered here dusting both my s1 and the previous generation seed from the same mix as the fathers
Is there ever a point I can get this to that would finally be worthy of breeding material stabilized enough to start introducing to other strains?
My first thoughts when I hear bag seed from a dispensary is… were they working on their own seed lines? You’re already at a 50/50 between stray pollen or herm pollen.
The s1 you created by stressing the fem may also potentially show a higher rate of herm traits in the progeny. Only way to know is to grow out a good number and find out.
A quick search led me to humboldt seed co… seems like it’s a BX8. Which would explain the stability you’re describing amongst the Phenos. But there’s no way to know for sure without talking to the person who grew them at the dispensary.
If you’re just pollen chucking go for it. If you actually want to breed it I’d prefer to start with trusted and known genetics. That’s not to say that you couldn’t make that breeding material. (Lot’s of todays legendary strains came from bag seeds). You’d just have to run enough to know what traits it holds and whether or not it will put out herms in the off-spring.
Well if there wasnt males in the mix from the original seed I’d question herm pollen but being there was a few of em in the unknown that rules out that as any herm pollen would be feminized if I’m not mistaken. So any seeds resulting from my s1 needs to be watched closely with care watching for herm traits? The s1 parent didn’t stress till later in the season so most the seeds I’ve got are tiny and not having great luck germinating and only have 1 seed left of the original bag seeds which is where my gears are shifting to strain preservation. Our dispensary here is in southern California but suppliers are up north from my understanding so that would align likely with Humboldt seed company being a possible origin. That’s just it, I don’t want to be a chucker, want to breed with a purpose. I’ve worked with this one for a couple years now and hate to throw away any further work with it from unknown origins. Smell profile is very unique and smells like a grape flavored musky perfume that will shift more to a smell of a fine wine later it’s left in the season and had shown the same consistency rubbing the stems on the males and the flowers I’ve grown. So I guess my main concern I should mainly be watching for is herms in the offspring in my s1 but the female from my regs shouldn’t be much of a concern?
Oh yeah, you can do that. You can make an IBL from anything, it just takes a number of generations of work. But it also takes some numbers too, because if you don’t use enough plants you’ll eventually lock in some negative traits.
Inbreeding shouldn’t be done too quickly, and for most people, backcrossing should be used at least as often. Crossing to earlier generations moves a line toward pheno consistency, but not genetic homozygosity. Backcrossing is a good tool to use in conjunction with inbreeding in small numbers to ensure the offspring is at least as good as the previous generation.
But if you just want to create a set of seeds with pheno consistency, you only need to backcross. It won’t have the same value for outcrossing as an IBL, but you’ll get a set of seeds that are all similar.
The reason for so many generations is stabilization for desired traits though correct? Say this is the one that has hit as far down as bx8, wouldn’t that mean it’s already been stabilized and gonna be pretty consistent aside from any traits the last cross back to the beginning picked up not expressed in the previous? Also given they would be a bx8 crossed with the offspring of each other would that make then a bx9 or a new f generation?
If you like it, then don’t worry about anything else. Make a goal for what you want to get out of it, and then start growing and breeding from the seeds you have.
You’ll get there when you get there. The semantics aren’t important until you’re trying to communicate what you did to someone else.
Backcrossing and inbreeding do different things genetically. If your parent is very heterozygous, then backcrossing will make your seeds more like the parent (very heterozygous).
Inbreeding tends to increase homozygousity, which is more stable to outcrossing. So “inbred lines” are more desirable to breed with than “backcrossed lines”.
But you can mix backcrossing and inbreeding as necessary. At some point the conventions don’t easily describe the process. It’s uncertain if you have bx8 f2 or something else without knowing the pollen donor parent.
Well the goal is to have a stable strain that I can ultimately take some landrace strains and look for a unicorn with that no one else really has, seems like purple panty dropper never really went mainstream or an everyday known strain and since it is something unique and incredible I think it’s worthy of a good starter to play with. Def understand it takes several generations but I guess I’m trying to figure out how much work has been done already and at what point it’s considered good breeder stock getting consistent traits ending up in the offspring and crosses into new genetics
I think the easiest way to determine that is to inbreed it for a generation and then grow as many of them as you can.
Inbreeding will fan out heterozygous strains into different traits. If you start seeing differences after growing a bunch of plants side by side, then you’ll start to get an appreciation for what level of variations you would also have contributed from male pollen in the line.
Is there any pros or cons when making new crosses in using either a male or female of the most desired traits of a strain? For example if u really like the smell of a strain your trying to cross with a new one is it likely to have those notes primarily from using the female of that strain or a male or gonna expect a 50/50 flip of the coin of which it will resemble more with a possible mix of both or something new?
It’s definitely not an ibl but the 3 parents are stable. I would proceed with caution using a female you stressed to hermi and get fen seeds.
That’s an undesirable trait that’s usually avoided like the plague.
As far as getting what you have to an inbred line the easier way would be to do an open pollination or selective pollination of the sibling seeds for at least 5 generations.