What he said. Commercial effect on breeding

Yes, it always comes down to a pheno hunt, but the more stable the line of plants, or canines, the better your odds go up of finding a keeper.

Side note: @Grayeyes, what kind of uniformity do you expect out of a 10 pack of F1 fems?

Today, I am gonna pick on the Poodle for my analogy.
I believe most on here think of a lap dog when they think about Poodles.
I also believe some on here may know that Poodles were originally bred to be retrievers.
I doubt too many people on here are aware that there are still a few working lines of Poodles still being bred true to type.
These working lines still maintain all the desired traits that their ancestors were bred to do.
Them pet shop Poodles, not so much.
They have been bred to be pretty (bag appeal), all the while letting the genes that actually made them useful, fall by the wayside.
It’s easy to breed for one trait at a time, such as pretty, but it is hard to breed for several traits at one time, and keep an actual balance going, while at the same time, making gentle improvements to the line here and there with inbreeding and outbreeding.
Anyone want to guess how many more pet shop breeders there are of Poodles, versus working line breeders?

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I want to highlight an important part of this video, all cannabis terpene profiles have medicinal benefits that vary widely. Of 90,000 US samples, only 3 dominant terpene profiles emerged. Any other diversity was sorely outnumbered. Recreational stuff aside, that’s a tragedy for medicinal users.

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It isn’t Hawaiian, as in the line of plants used for a lot of the breeding projects but I’m currently working on the f9 generation of a Kona Gold IBL that’s been unbroken since pre ‘74.

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By Kid, I’m unsure if you meant underaged. If you were, do you think that could have a had an impact on your experience as well?

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I think it does for sure, having used marijuana infrequently from 12-18 and then frequently from 20-27 it’s definitely a different experience and not using as a teen changes your overall experience as well.

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Legalization in Cali and Colorado opened the door for breeders to run larger numbers and better selections. That doesn’t mean they all did, but they had the ability to do so. In the seventies and eighties, the only place you were going to get seeds was from import weed (would never quite finish in the states, and we did try) or from Holland. The Dutch had NL and SK#1 in everything, and they did not grow warehouses full of flower to perform selection. Every strain out there (including hazes) had some combination of those two cultivars. That’s why you see the coffee shops with more North American strains on the menu than Dutch strains. Better selection.

Every “elite” cut in the history of cuts came from an ordinary strain that just happened to have the right combination of genetic characteristics most people were looking for at the time and in the present. What’s the first thing people do with elite cuts? Outcross them. I’d wager a bet that 98% percent of the people that claim to have a cut from 30 years ago is FOS.

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Well id say at 15 I was pretty young to be doing what i did. But i was researching cannabis, alchemy, and psychedelics from 12 so i was a bit different :slight_smile: I smoked plenty of herb that didnt make me hallucinate too lol

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These feel like shark infested waters, so I’m hesitant to weigh in. Lots of parrots on cannabis forums that like to be keyboard warriors. But here’s a little insight, and some people will likely loose their poop over some of what I’m about to say, but oh well, here goes.

I’m a craft/boutique breeder that’s held and worked with a lot of old and new stuff.

I currently hold 80’s pnw blueberry, stardawg Corey, glitterbomb, papaya, straw guava, bbm, Macdaddy, NorCal Dosi (yes, ogkb is great), slh franco, MOB, lemon G, illudium, and some I’m forgetting. I recently culled original/weasel diesel, Z, Berger bubba, and several others older and important strains after holding them for years along with most of what I mentioned. I also hold some hunted stuff, none of them contain cookies (maybe one?). Right now it’s Dream Axis, Grapefruit x Blueberry, Goji OG, Dragonsblood Hashplant, a hunted white widow cut, BBM x Staten Island Diesel, and some Congo x Blueberry and some mutants…

Gushers and Gush Mints are volumes better to grow than any of the plants going around as TK, and they yield and the high is nearly as good, and maybe better depending on what you’re after. There is magic in crossing cookies hybrids with old school strains imo.

SLH Franco is probably the most beautiful and perfect hybrid plant I’ve ever grown. It deserves the accolades, as does a lot of the old Dutch work. My widow will put modern strains to shame in many regards. Beautiful structure and buds that stack for days. Chop it early and the high isn’t nearly as good and it feels like a short lived cookies dispo high. Weird, huh? :thinking::wink:

Z is finicky but tough to kill and makes good progeny, that blueberry can look stunning or like a mutanty mess, don’t grow it well and it’s not great. Grow them well and they’re some of the best daytime smoke you’ll ever have.

Many of the cookies and related cuts in circulation are around for good reason. I don’t hold many of them because I’d rather make non cookie, but my cookies hybrids are always fun to sort through. Sorting through and growing cookies stuff for myself made me realize that a lot of people on the internet like to repeat things they’ve heard. So, now you’ll see people claiming nothing cookies gets them high, or it’s always short lived. But, it’s nonsense, it’s all based on a lot of variables.

I will say, I find that if I smoke any one thing for days in a row the high gets muted. I smoked white widow for 6 months straight and it was getting tiresome by the end, while others ill develop tolerance for much quicker. OG and gelato types can be like this for me. Some gelato hybrids are VERY OG like in smoke. Mixing it up and not getting used to any one chemovar or type is helpful for me. I mix it up every day and generally won’t even smoke something more than twice in a row. Today I’ve smoked Blue Nerds (love this one), Gushers, and I’m about to smoke some white widow. Tomorrow I’ll probably smoke my stank muffin (blueberry muffin x (SIC x Sour D IbL) and some gelato 41 and bubble bath.

My favorite smoke right now is the stank muffin, I’m trying to not run out. It’s chemically muffin with a really great high. It’s beautifully structured and roots in a cup of tap water in about 10 days. It was the only viable seed from a BBM plant I pollinated 2023 outdoor. The narrative that great plants are 1 in 1000 or some exorbitant number is nonsense. I find and cull great plants all the time, in my own work and others work. This example is not the norm, but I’d run 50 S1 cereal milk I’d find multiple great plants. Something that’s made with two great plants will consistently yield really nice plants. Then again, so will some of the SLH beans I’ve made and been sent by others, some strains just lend themselves to great progeny.

/info dump off

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Was this in a cob form? Makes me wonder if fermentation potentially played a role as well.

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More basting a whole room with the same pollen, by laziness.

It’s averaging the grade exponentially, and when these chunked lines meet again … you get another layer of exponential degradation. At one point, when everybody on thousands have the same grand pa or grand ma, the party is less fun.

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The thai? Doubt it was import cob style. It was a 3 hits of a pinner doobie held in for a long time. My friends uncle said it was special. Irregular racing Heart beats, dry mouth. Physical paralysis to somedegree. Full multicolored mostly blue closed eye visuals in the dark. I still hunt for something like it. Smellboat said he had a chocolate thai that did the same. So not necessarily related to environment.

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I completely agree. I do believe that the odds of finding special ones increases significantly though.

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Yep, my second favorite plant right now has wacky dense bush like structure, variegation and mutant leaves, and is mix of… white widow, blueberry, duck ibl, huckleberry, sour d, berry freak, blueberry muffin and vintage blueberry. It smells like no other plant and reminds me of omija/schizandra berry. It’s bitter, and sweet, and savory… It’s also VERY difficult to kill and has a lovely saty high that seems to get me really high every time I go back to it. The first 15 minutes are disorienting then I’m ready to GO!

That excites me way more than the elites I hold or have held.

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Got any pics of this anywhere? Sounds crazy

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Lol! Now I want a Huckleberry cultivar :wink: I think it’s folks like you and Bodhi (I’ve never ran his gear) that are analogous to the craft beer makers. You’re the exception though. Don’t get me wrong, I love the oldies as much as anyone. AK is still in my top five, but I have to dig for that special one that rings my bell.

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She made it through two snows and lots of 30f weather and was put out of her misery yesterday after being dumped outside in late sept as an old mom. Pollinated with a great Drunken Bastard boy I found, do should be a fun one! I also crossed her to Blue Diesel Pops which is Sour D BX3 F4 x BBM x Vintage blueberry.


There are a bunch of better pics in my grow log. She doesn’t variegate outdoors or under 12/12. From what I can tell.

I call her Blue Popgun now, but freaky blue widow and blue widow freak were other names along the way

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Before I collected seeds and plants I collected and farmed corals, at one point I had well over 200 unique pieces that I’d frag (“clone”). I always ended up liking the ones that were unique and not necessarily the in your face colorful corals.

Thanks for mentioning me in the same breath as Bodhi, I don’t deserve it, but I sure appreciate it. I do suspect Bodhi and I would get along splendidly :joy:

I’m absolutely loving the Goji OG and Dragon’sblood hp I’m growing right now. But, I’m also really excited about the permanent marker x tahoe og x runtz I found. I don’t discriminate :man_shrugging:

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I agree with your assessment of Franco as well. He had a real passion for the plant that you don’t see in many of the modern breeders/pheno hunters. Bear in mind that when I’m referencing the Dutch strains, I’m talking about the late seventies, early eighties. Everything was ordered from a catalogue, and you were never sure what you were getting.

At the end of the day, we stand on the backs of giants that were willing to give up their freedom for the cause. Some for money, but many more for the freedom to explore the genetics and unlock everything we enjoy today.

I just bought my first pack of Bodhi recently. You can only read, hear and see so many good things before you have to give him a go :wink:

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I pop lots of packs at the same time and often run several to a pot side by side. It’s kind of like Survivor and they’ll vote each other off the island. I’ll just say, imo it’s more about finding the great packs than it is the great plants. Then you find the best plants in the great packs.

@Low.Poly Here’s my oddball (blue popgun) in veg, these popped up when looking for another pic so thought I’d showing a better pic. Should be flower pics in my log


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Yoooo thats awesome thanks for sharing

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