Dutched Durban. Yeah, they like to forget about northern lights or whatever Afghan was used to stabilize it, which is why I’ve avoided them when searching for the pure landrace… I have a couple different “pure” Durban. Cannabiogen, which I grew and have concerns about purity, due to the fast flowering time on all the plants, and The Landrace Teams Durban Highland , from a private collector, which I have hopes for, and which goes 12-16 weeks, which seems right. The Durban I grew several years ago is either SSSC or Flying Dutchman from the 80’s. I can’t remember which, and i cant say it was pure, because I dont know those companies, but the flowering onset was late for anything other than a sativa. My stuff is sativa dominant and it was a full month later to flower. Haven’t seen my friend in awhile to ask him what it was for sure… He’d lost the seeds for awhile before finding them a short while ago. He got them from a local Guerrilla farmer thats grown in the area longer than me, and he’s the one that made the original purchase. I only used Two of the males’ pollen. The third was fasciated or poly or whatever its called. Gave a super “up” buzz to my strain when crossed into it.
I grew one seed from a pack of sensi seeds durbin , it was a male but definitely had thin fingers on a bright neon green plant that took so long to produce pollen I was barely able to breed with it.lt looked Nothing like the durbin cut or plants from seed I see most people grow. I’d consider looking there is three somebody that specializes in and races although I don’t recall any durbin offerings lately but I’ve been obsessing more over kush and Indian varitietys lately
I was involved in some very large outdoor grows of what I think was Dutch Passions Durban back in the late 90s . All I know is it was Durban and it looked sativa but grew and flowered like an indica. Was a great strains for outdoors , wasn’t crippling potent but was nice , and had a black licorice smell and taste.
There is no such thing as “Durban” landrace, the local strain has always been called Durban Poison. Foreigners just used the name to help sell it. Durban is a city here in South Africa. It’s a large seaport trading area and sugar cane is grown in the surrounding areas. The local strains got called Durban Poison because you had to go there to buy in bulk. The strain is gown in the KwaZulu Natal coastal area. I only know of one local guy who refers to it as “durban” which is because he’s preserving various strains from the area and that one line was actually grown in a township right by Durban city. Literally no one from here will call it “Durban”. If someone gave you seeds and called it “Durban” then they are changing its name for some reason.
What we were growing was called Durban Poison . I also wasn’t trying to claim it as a landrace but actually pointing out the opposite. Call me crazy but most landrace sativas would never finish outdoors in northern canada, let alone by the end of Sept like those Durban did.
I have no idea what your actual problem is around this subject . Or why you seem to have such a chip on your shoulder around it. I am not trying to argue with anyone , just sharing my experience.
Just sharing too, that “Durban” isnt a thing and sorry wasn’t directed at just you but others also calling it an incorrect name. I’m just kinda confused at an attempt to “preserve” something by not knowing if you even have the real thing and then naming it incorrectly. And my chip comes from growers and breeders being looked down on and needing “saving” when all of the issues around purity of these strains come from outside / foreigner interference in the 1st place.
Ya man I just don’t get how you seem to think preserving genetics as someone looking down upon the growers where the genetics are found.
You see the same thing in the vegetable world with farmers being introduced to hybrids that yield far more and are easier to grow.
I grow heirloom and heritage varieties in my vegetable garden so that I can make seed and have some independence over my food source. They keep me fed and I am not reliant on someone else for next years crop.
I see these weed preservation runs as the same.
World of seeds sells Kwazulu. I’ve seen some killer looking plants pop out of their grows. Sounds like they use the proper name at least, even if it isnt pure.
We’re using the name Durban Highland or Durban poison to avoid confusion because thats what the purchased seeds were called, and thats what the majority of growers recognize as the proper name, even if incorrect. Its common for something to be named for the region it was found in. Kerala, Moroccan etc. Wrong terminology by Westerners is common if you are looking at it from an indigenous standpoint. Kerala is a large region and has many cultivars or landraces, none known locally as kerala. Names like Idukki and Chellakutti are used locally. Beldia ( homeland)is the name used in Morocco. Calling something by the region it was found in helps people understand where its from
Part of reproducing a landrace is finding it to begin with, which is the hard and costly part, and success won’t always occur the first try. Seeds have to be grown to see what comes of them. This is especially true of the kwazulu or “durban” landrace, due to all the frauds out there claiming purity. Ive been searching for it for years, to use at work.
@Greenhighlander I feel the same way. Corporations will be patenting strains in the next few years, and i fear Monsanto and other scum will be very involved in the weed business in the near future. They will claim ownership of anything with skunk in it, which is everything but true landrace or heirloom stock, leaving the bulk of humanity smoking genetically altered shit if those strains disappear.
Maybe Kwazulu is in good hands near Durban, but that doesnt help the rest of us that have no landraces.
They must be preserved and spread for all humanity, not just a few people.
If no help is needed to help preservation efforts, why is it that unless “durban” seeds are from at least 35 or 40 year old stock they are not pure? Contamination. When every last tiger is in a zoo, are they not endangered? When every last pure seed is only found in a private collection. Is it not endangered?
THIS IS WHAT WE CAME FOR !!! Overgrow the WORLD hahahaha
And your see club is going to prevent this? Your preservation efforts are very noble and with good intentions but its nowhere near what’s needed to preserve a strain. You need to be 200% sure of origin, you need genetic data to compare it and then when you know you’ve got the right thing it should be sealed and deposited in a proper seedbank which is geared towards long term storage.
And lastly, I know you guys wont like this…but why should people who have been ripped off and fucked over numerous times by foreigners give up their strains? People have grown these strains for decades in close knit communities. While they made almost no money off of it, got fucked up by cops, got their houses and vegetable field sprayed with poison no outsiders came to help. They instead stole the genetics and names to profit off of it.
Farmers in India have approached people like Cocogenes in a desparate attempt to stave off extinction of some of their landraces. The young kids are not interested in growing them, and the amount of people growing these traditional varieties is shrinking, not growing, with an inevitable end result unless something is done about it. Strainhunters are intentionally contaminating some of the last pure stock in an attempt to corner the market. A dangerous, greedy prospect. I fear for the loss of valuable cannabinoid profiles with the loss of landraces.
The best we can do is to create awareness about what is being lost, and to try and create enthusiasm to grow landraces in this latest generation. A permanent link between indigenous farmers growing these landraces with paying customers from the west will provide monetary incentive for them to continue to grow something that may not yield as much as a modern hybrid. Until that time comes, we do what must be done. Preserve.
Hemp farming is another landrace killer. Its spreading very quickly in some places like India or Thailand, and since males arent pulled, pollen goes everywhere. The safest place for a repro may indeed be in a closet before much longer.
I think we have more in common than what you may have first thought.
ElChiscas, a Mexican grower that supplied Cannabiogen with some gems , estimates that between 40-60% of their landraces are gone.
I offered him anything I have, free of charge of course, as money is not the goal. It never will be.
This thing got crazy fast. I dont see what the big deal is. Any strian I get I automatically assume its not exactly what its supposed to be.
And of course if you were to ask two different ethnic people to share an experience they both shared of course the story is going to be different. They are from two different people. If they embellish the history of history then shame on them.
@Upstate I appreciate the work you do.
That being said. I have anxiety and depression issues. If I have either at any given moment smoking doesn’t help. It can make it worse.
I think @Foreigner said it best:
"I find it accentuates what you already feel. I don’t like to smoke on days I’m feeling down because there’s a good chance it will make me feel shittier.
I think of it as a positivity enhancer. And a negativity enhancer. But I only like to enhance the positive."
I think Indicas help me the most. Sitivas I believe make my anxiety worse. But I haven’t had a full blown anxiety attack since the shity Mexican brick days. Mexican brick there’s a land race worth saving lol. Sometime when I smoke I end up dealing with alot of inner turmoil. Depending on how I feel at the time when I smoke I like to smoke alone. I’m still figuring out what strain that really dose the trick for me. So I get why people want to make crosses and I understand why people want to preserve strains. Even if the strain being saved isn’t 100% its still the closest thing to the real deal and I can appreciate that.
Yup. I dont consider anything a landrace until growing it out shows that it probably is, and thats where OG members will be a big help. If you buy the first offering you come across, odds are you won’t find what you are looking for. I looked for some strains for more than 3 years before making a purchase. That’s why we need help growing out what we have. To see what we have or don’t have while there is still time to locate the real deal if we strike out the first time.
Why not help @anon98152597? Not everyone has bad intensions. I dont like Arjan any more than you do. I dont think landraces were meant to be owned. They were meant to be used by man. Imagine if the Inca kept the potato, or the chinese kept rice, or the Middle Easterners kept Barley? The whole world would have missed out.
Sadly, I don’t think it’s enough, but it’s something I can do from here so I’m doing it. Could it become enough? Yes I think it can be, with enough interested people from here and Landrace regions working together. One of the major obstacles I have found, is that indigenous Farmers give their seeds in bulk to a company to be sold. Maybe they are getting 25 or 50 cents a seed or perhaps a dollar, but probably less. And then they see their seeds sold for ten bucks a piece, and they get angry about it, and rightly so. They no longer want to share because of the bad experience they’ve had being taken advantage of. I’d like to remove the middle man, and introduce the indigenous Growers directly to the clients that would buy their seeds.
Currently there is nobody with landrace marijuana stock of any consequence in the International Community. Until such time as a Trusted Source can be found, the safest place for these landraces outside of their homes, and sometimes even in their home regions, are in a refrigerator or a freezer. Not a perfect set-up, but it should buy 10 to 20 years time if only one repro is done. It is my hope that by that time in the future mankind will realize what is disappearing and will begin to do something about it. I personally believe biosphere reserves need to be set up where landrace’s can thrive in their home climate without any threat of contamination beyond the douchebag with a bag full of Kush seed. I know the minimum number listed for healthy germplasm is in the neighborhood of 2,000 individuals, but I don’t believe all landrace’s arose from an initial stockpile of that many seeds. Even a 10 pack of seeds, reproduced in their native climate, will multiply and begin to fill the environmental voids that are available in that local climate, again becoming what that climate dictates it needs to be for survival. Mother Nature is the ultimate breeder of all. There is DNA evidence that all Humanity stems from one woman, yet we have healthy populations with lots of variation stemming from that one individual. Isolation equals variation . I see our efforts as more of a last resort should disaster strike. At least there would be something left of the landrace to start with, and it gives me the satisfaction of knowing that I’m trying to do something, rather than just watching everything disappear helplessly.
As far as genetic data goes, I don’t thoroughly Trust what has already been tested. Any person right now can send a sample into phylos and call it whatever he wants, regardless of its accuracy. I think the locals are a better resource for determining authenticity, as they know their own landrace’s better than anyone. These companies currently have money as a motivating factor. A quick look on phylos will “show” many landraces have skunk in them rather than the other way around. Which of course is bullshit. What they are trying to do, is to say that skunk is the ancestor of everything, since skunk was made by somebody and in theory could be patented. They could come to your landrace grow once legalization occurs, take a sample of one of your plants, and say that there’s skunk in it, and pull your crop. I read about an Indiana potato farmer that had his own potato crop pollinated by Monsanto pollen, and when they came and took a sample of his potatoes the following year, they said “you didn’t pay us for your seed, and we own the rights to the seed, so pay us for the seed or lose your crop”. I don’t recall the outcome, but it wasn’t good for the farmer. Big corporations won’t be happy until they have their fingers in every cookie jar in existence. But they can’t own any landrace material. They didn’t develop it. They can’t keep you from growing it or any hybrids made from it in a legal environment.
Thats a good question. I suppose in the end, it’s because it’s the right thing to do. I know for a fact some people that get their hands on Landrace seeds we give out will have bad intensions. I give them out to find the good people. They exist.
You live in sativa country, so I don’t know if you’ve seen the onslaught of what hybrid weed can do to a younger generation. Kids with no motivation at all that only want to eat or sleep. Of course that can’t be blamed on Downer weed alone, but i personally think they need some good old fashioned sativa medicine to get them going, and it’s far too scarce.
And then there are the medicines that can be developed from these landraces. I always love giving big Pharma a kick in the nuts when I can. Preserving and making accessible landrace’s that can be used freely by anyone on Earth will keep many people from getting addicted to nasty Pharmaceuticals, or taking unnecessary medications that require other medications for their side effects. Weed was put here for man kind to use in all sorts of ways. The one plant Humanity can live off of. Food, clothing, shelter, Recreation, medicine. The all in one plant.
Headband/Yeti makes me angry, usually at the person who sold it to me. Last time (before I started growing) I stopped buying dispensary weed for a month.
Wow, alot of anger here. Everyone who is mad should go smoke a doob.
I don’t grow any pure landrace strains, but I do continue to grow a lineage, I have f13 super silver sour diesel haze. Its not the same as it started for sure, but I grow it with love. Its getting stronger via selection, and its changing its structure and coloring too. From f10 I’ve been picking the more purple and red plants, I just grew out a seed from a f12 green plant and it showed no color changing at all, vs the purple plant seeds which finish dark purple/ maroon. When I grow it for seed, I prefer to grow only it just to try and keep it as pure as I can, no worries about hermie beans. When I got it from my dad at f8 only maybe 10% of my plants turned purple, 2 gens later 50/50, at 2 more gens and I haven’t had a green plant yet from my purple seeds or any purpling on my green seeds. I’m abandoning the greens because they just didn’t keep the skunkiness… apparently I accidentally bred that out.
I see keeping landraces as even more of a challenge, you need multiple males, expressing as many of the genetic combinations as possible. Your not selecting and breeding your favorites, your allowing the gene pool to stay large… anyone who can and does this work gets mad props from me. Landraces I’m sure have cannabinoid, terpene, lactone, ketone, and phenol profiles that have been either bred out or lost in developed cannabis lineages. So preserving these is extremely important.