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Not going to spill the beans (hahaha) until it gets into my hands, but I’m very excited about what will probably be my last trade of 2022, and it’s a doozy. With my Vortex co-op grow coming up and learning more about pollination and seed making, I realized that what my genetic stash was lacking, along with the experience of using it, was pollen. Looking at my seed glut and continued acquisition of them, clearly the only thing to do was diversify my holdings, so I found a member on here with a freezer full of kickass pollen from AKBB and Bob Hemphill plants who wanted to trade for some outdoor heirlooms and landraces for next summer’s grow. We’re at the same latitude North, so the outdoor varieties I have are perfect, gathered in anticipation of finding someone around here with a yard who wants to grow and I could hold their hand/use their plant count for selection and my own edification.

I have to sit down with a calendar and sketch out the rest of my grow year through the spring, but I think I’ll have a window to try branch pollination of the plants currently in veg while the Vortex seedlings are all still too small to be pollinated, in accordance with the Co-op Run rules on no other pollination activities in the same area. I run two tents, and the ventilation could easily be split and filtered, but I’d prefer to not goof around with the rules or my setup that works well right now.

It’s a split of old school NL and Hashplant and modern Chem pollens so I think I’m going to stay in the family roughly and hit the Blue Tara and Icy Grape with the old dank, while the LDSC and Sowah Grapefruit are gonna get some the Chems. If it works well, I’ll definitely be giving some of those seeds away here in the spring when they’re ready, first dibs for my homies here in the thread and other places on OG I interact with a bunch. I’ll also see what’s up with how much pollen I get, it’s from big outdoor plants so it could be a lot, if it is, I will share with y’all. Joining OG has been great for me, not just to learn and get support on growing my own, but to interact with other folks about genetics and to see them spread around freely or bartered fairly.

I truly think we’re going to make sure that no matter how fucked the legalization of weed continues to be, with bottlenecking genetics and big corporate MSOs doing cutthroat things towards smaller cultivators and breeders (see @Tracker 's thread for some real fucked up shit from the Midwest recently, a straight hit job on the little guys at a public competition by the organizers), we are going to make sure that there’s fridges and freezers and buried Mason jars full of preserved seedlines everywhere. People have a lot of justified fears about the future of cannabis, but the way I see it is that Pandora’s Box is open, we’ve had the chance to interact in the open like this and spread the seed, at a scale beyond anything in the underground years, and that can’t be undone. There’s still so much still hidden or missing and maybe lost, and lots of work to do reproducing and sharing rare stuff, but it’s happening and I don’t think it’ll stop.

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Time for another link dump, this time it’s some stuff from DJ Short’s classes that he teaches, a full video and a thread with the complete syllabus and conversation by OP who attended the class while on the forum, followed by a bunch of podcasts and a surprising number of long videos of panels DJs been on, he’s really been doing the legalization festivals and conferences for a long time, I didn’t expect to find so much! I fell down a bit of a rabbit hole when reading about the use of colchicine historically in cannabis breeding to induce polyploidy mutations, going back to the first books by Bill Drake and Mel Frank that gave instructions on it. People have said that they’ve never met anyone as knowledgeable about colchicine in the cannabis world as DJ is if you take his class, and he’s long admitted to possible mutagen use in developing his breeding lines, so that’s an interesting factoid. I’m hoping there’s some more commentary by him in some of these breeder panels I’m finding.

Old video with a bunch of good interviews, DJ first then Subcool, Kyle Kushman, and more:

2016 Indo Expo Portland panel on breeding:

Bonkers looking panel from Seattle Hempfest 2015, particularly interesting for having Mowgli Holmes on it pre-Phylos talking about cannabis genetics and licensing:

A second video of the same panel from a different angle:

2013 Denver Cannabis Cup breeders panel:

DJ comes in at 24:00

DJ on hashish:

DJ at 15:30

DJ interviewed by NORML TV:

DJ onstage at Seattle Hempfest:

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Wow, that link dump is a gold mine dude, gonna take some time to work through all of that, I’ve seen the video of him talking about hash, that and some of the FCP and frenchie videos sent me on a hash quest that I’m still getting to the bottom of. Stoked to hear about your plans too, what kind of stuff are you holding for outdoors? I’m doing the same looking for stuff that works well here in VT, planning next year to run some copa p25, and up in the air on the other spot, might run some stuff from some local breeders I know, but also considering running some of rebel frown’s gear or trying to find some more landrace-y stuff that’ll do good up here. I’m hoping to find some gems and maybe line work em forward for a couple years like the old head outdoor growers used to yaknow? Blessings to OG for bringing us all together right?

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I liked that Luther Burbank quote he dropped in the middle about taking the best and rejecting the rest, tells ya something about his breeding techniques. I still hasn’t watched most of them myself but I see now how that hash one got you fired up, that’s a damn fine argument for traditional hash he made.

The outdoor stuff I’ve picked up is mostly older heirlooms and landrace stuff that is outdoor proven, got some M33 x R2 NL2, some Durban crosses and straight up, got that P25 and it seems like the Ancient OG is a killer outdoors in the North, both by itself and in crosses. Lotta stuff from Fleur Du Mal, since many of those are old school quick and dual use strains like Bubblegum or Sweet Tooth. And then a bunch of OG seeds including some autos. IDK I haven’t gotten a real plan together just picked up what looked good when I saw it, I haven’t met many people around here since moving back during a pandemic so no outdoor gromies yet, but I’ll meet them eventually. I’ll never be able to grow outdoors where I am in the middle of town unfortunately, it’ll always be a project for helping a homie with at their house somewhere a little outside.

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Definitely lots of landrace/heirloom for up where you are, you ever look at www.nordicgenetics.net/en ? They’ve got some real hardcore outdoor genetics over there from Derg Corra/Fatman Lala and others. FYI the current exchange rate is 7 DKK to the US dollar. They have a ton of the gnarliest toughest stuff I’ve seen, and lots of it traditional photoperiod if that matters to you.

I’ve also been really intrigued by The Guy Downtown, who is sold by Hoku Seed Co. He’s got some hybrids with a population of Lolab Valley Lemon Kashmir that he did two season of OP on right where you are latitude wise, he’s in southern Maine.

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Lots to unpack there, it sounds like you’ve got a good outdoor stable. One dude I know of that breeds in the area gave me some seeds that use the Friesland that do really well up here, ran one of em i doors but I’m tempted to run em outside too to see the differences. I was also eyeing the ancient OG to run outside as well. I can only do 2 plants outdoors myself here with the plant counts the way that they are, so I gotta be selective about it. I’ll have to look into that vendor you mentioned, I was thinking about some Nepalese genetics just because of their resistances to mold in wet humid and cold conditions which seems to be what we’re getting here in fall time these days

dude that bred that friesland grows a cut of sweet tooth as well, says he loves it for outdoor here, i gotta see if h es got seeds!

Heres the link to the log i put together for that friesland cross, its friesland x god bud and he calls it “Niben” which is the name of a god in the abenaki language, kinda cool stuff: Niben F4 -Anthos Seeds

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Thanks for the link, I’m gonna give that a read today. I am definitely fascinated by how some of the old SSSC outdoor varieties still have such a following up North as proven performers, especially the Friesland/Freezeland and the Erdbeer that people suspect is in the Strawberry Fields, among others. I’ve heard of Viking still being common among old northern heads, the Danes seem to have adopted that one as their local heirloom judging by Nordic Genetics and other seedbanks I’ve seen from there. They also seem to have latched onto and kept using some of the old hardy Canadian outdoor strains like Guerilla Gold, Texada Timewarp, Pinewarp, and Mighty Mite/Lowryder

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the strawberry fields is still very present from some old heads here in VT for sure, never heard of the Erdbeer, but im gonna have to look into that one for sure.

dont judge me too harshly on that Niben journal, i dont think i did the variety justice, needed more food and i dont think it bangs indoors like it does out, hence my wanting to give-er another go :sweat_smile:

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Yup yup it’s definitely still around, I’ve heard of local circulation of the cut but I haven’t found it yet even to ask about. The theory is that Strawberry Fields is probably an Erdbeer crossed to an indica decades ago, for the perfect hardy northern strain. Just like that Friesland, the Erdbeer was bred in absolutely terrible climate in Europe, cold and rainy and short seasoned just like New England!

Roms is the man:

Old Dubi thread from 2007 with Esbe, H&L, others:

Erdbeer is supposed to be a worked version of an Alpine strain, just like the Purpurea Ticinicis that Breeder Steve says he found with some old ladies in a high mountain village who were growing it for “decoration”. In that era, for a long time you could grow marijuana in Switzerland legally as long as it was an ornamental or for perfume/scents/dried decorations, it was only illegal to smoke it. So you could buy weed in stores legally as “potpourri satchets” with a wink and then go open the pouch and smoke it. The Erdbeer got crossed to PT and that’s the Erdpurt.

Esbe from Hybrids from Hell, another Danish breeder, is the reigning expert on these lines from everything I’ve found, his seeds are at European seedbanks:

Post in thread ‘afghan, cross erd purt’ https://www.icmag.com/threads/afghan-cross-erd-purt.85921/post-2405713

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This is something I’m learning the hard way, I have mostly been concerned with stretch height and plant size but I’m realizing that there really are some strains that don’t show intersex or anything inside, they’re just mid. Along with clone expression being different along with environmental expression. I gotta post up some photos today, but I’ve been thinking about it a lot since growing Bodhi’s Cherry Unicorn. My first round of it was impeccable, just the dankest buds, huge harvest, easy trim etc. The clone run was a good harvest of middie buds with the same top cherry note but none of the dankness or frost and density, which could have been from cloning or more likely from temps and humidity being higher and less controlled in the flowering of the second round. Thus learning that this one absolutely needs cool temps and dryness to express resin and terps, in a way I hadn’t had demonstrated yet in my short growing experience. Based on that, I’d say the Cherry Unicorn probably bangs outdoors like a big frosty Afghan would.

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Yes man, this is my finding, with that Niben I have benefit of speaking directly with the breeder and seeing how they perform outdoors and its head and shoulders above what I was able to achieve. Granted my setup is a little different now and there’s a lot I could improve upon, but I think some stuff just wants to be out under the sun, and given that I like the smoke off my half assed attempt I’m ready to oblige and see how it goes

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Here’s an interesting profile of DJ, if you feel like reading it: » The Willy Wonka of Pot

Just bear in mind that it was written for people who don’t spend all day on weed-growing websites haha. Still a fun little read.

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The dude really does lean into the Willy wonka vibe doesn’t he :joy::joy:

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I know peripherally of the breeder here in VT who claims to have bred the strawberry fields and works with it heavily but for all intents and purposes the guy is a wing nut, so I’ve steered clear of his gear in favor of some other folks I know and have good vibes, but damned if this doesn’t have me thinking about dipping a toe into that pool of crazy

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That’s a great interview, one of the best ever in the category IMO, it does a good job of telling you a lot while being playful, Grantland is one of my favorite long format reportage sites to read, their archives are worth a look there’s so much good stuff to read. I’ve read the DJ article probably a dozen times!

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That’s the thing all too often, isn’t it? The guys who have been in the game for their whole life and kinda can’t get out of the underground mentality, including the bad stuff like hard drugs and conspiracy theories, etc. @Wuachuma was just saying the other day that he had the opportunity to meet the breeder of AAA/Asian Fantasy in NorCal some years ago, he’s not a particularly hidden character but he is a tweaker and bath salts guy and Wu decided that it just wasn’t worth getting close to him. I can’t really disagree, I think if I were trying to source stuff from a guy like that I’d want at least one layer of person between me and them for my peace of mind, even if it made the trade or purchase more costly in the end from having to cut in a middleman. Sometimes paying a broker for a little insulation is really worth it, in my experiences through life.

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Yea man, I don’t need any of the drama that some of these people can bring, I’m just out here trying to source the fire for my little headstash garden same as the rest of us, I don’t need some dude in a tinfoil hat on my shoulder haha

Interesting comment from Lucky13 in 2006 on ICMag:

"As far as the strawberry fields… well I hate to burst everyones bubble but if there even is a strain called strawberry fields It has nothing to do with the the “kushman” cut of cough that was GIFTED to Kyle by the person that brought it down to Hartford CT.from the mt. mansfield area of VT probably 3 years or so before kyle even got a taste of it.

the person that brought it down from VT is a pretty good friend of mine. and he insists the cut is just a nl5 x local VT blue haze. it make me sick to see the lies that kyles made up about the cut all just to make himself sound cool/smart. who would have thought his lie would go international?"

Is that guy Strawberry Jerry? I found references to an Adam Dunn Show on Livestream that’s all about tracing the lineage of Strawberry Fields with Kyle and that guy IDK if any of it is believable or real but I can’t find the video or audio yet.

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Lol I didn’t want to drop the name Specifically but yea that’s him. Let me just say that I’ve never met the guy myself, and only have the word of some of the dudes I know who know him and his social media to go on, so I dont purport to know the truth about him, but you can kind of get a general vibe for a person from those outside sources.

I also don’t claim to know about the cough or it’s relationship to the fields cut, but his company is like “strawberry fields family farms” or something to that effect, so you can see where the info gets a little tangled up

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Here’s a fun find, my friends. I was cleaning in the garage around where I smoke yesterday and in the bottom of a box of junk I swept off a table long ago I found this not quite empty tub of budder that is probably two years old now. When I moved just before the pandemic I didn’t get a chance to meet any plugs in my new area and wasn’t growing yet, so I had a friend of mine work his connections to try and find me something. I got some absolutely bunk ass homegrown that barely gave me a headache, and a sack of these dabs from a guy who I wish he’d put me back in touch with, but I was told it was a one time thing. Great budder, got me lifted for a while until I got my med card and got to the dispensary, I’m gonna hit this up sometime today and see how it does after some cold curing for a year in the garage hahahaha.

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