thanks sebring, I wasn’t aware of that. for some reason I was under the impression that the first sample of a given strain would arbitrarily be considered ‘official,’ pretty much the ‘strain cops’ scenario.
sounds like they have addressed my concerns with this method, including all data points and their sources for comparison and allowing the community to draw their own conclusions.
5 Likes
I’m realizing my misunderstanding comes from a local clone and seed company Hermetic Genetics which states ‘all of our strains and cuttings are verified genuine by phylos’. When I looked at their phylos chart, they were not bred with a genuine og cut, but with barney’s farm femenized og seeds. because of the wording of the hermetic genetics advertising, it seemed like phylos was favoring large european commercial breeders by labeling mass produced fems as ‘official cuts’.
Looks like I should have gotten my information from the source, rather than a business using them as an advertising tool.
10 Likes
@zephyr & @cannabissequoia
I love the responses!!
The OG community should always be about educating and helping each other. I’ve learned a ton here and I’m glad I’m helping others! 
12 Likes
I am very happy to see this discussion taking place , I have read alot of the online speculation about what phylos is doing and a person can come to many conclusions or fears. Alot of the concern is due the fact that Robert Clark is involved with phylos bio science , he is on there advisorary board. Robert and Dave watson have worked together for many years (hortapharm) and on things that are not the best for the cannabis community but rather there pockets. Whether Dave is a snitch or not is open to debate but what isent is his support of plant patents, and gmo fuckery. So if Robert is involved with phylos it’s definetly something to be aware of with all that is going on and has in the past. From what I’m reading Dave has 29 patents already and his companies seem to always get dea and government support. He is now part of a medicinal company based out of colorado and tied to the first FDA approved medicine derived from cannabis.
6 Likes
I see that phylos is not quite equipped on there own but if they are tied to Robert and Robert wanted to help dave and a sample of the samples sent to them was sent to say GW pharmaceuticals does GW have the equipment to do the sequencing on there own and avoid the high cost associated. Could phylos just be a collection site , you get a small glimpse of the plant profile and they get samples from as many people as possible. The cost of sequencing as before mentioned is astronomical so it would be hard for anybody besides a huge company to consider doing .another thing to consider is with so many seed companies out there if a company wanted genetic samples and had the means to properly sequence them they could just purchase genetics from the vast array of breeders who sell them. It seems like making things open source is the only hope but if open source is based on a limited DNA profile wouldent somebody with a complete profile be able to still patent it , all I know is I’m keeping the beans I got lol
6 Likes
Maybe it’s all just a coincidence that the same people keep popping up around the companies that have to do with cannabis research specifically genetics . I could just be paranoid i do smoke alot of sativa lol
3 Likes
No sweat. 
You raise some valid observations & I’m sympathetically inclined. Highly suspicious of D Watson; He can’t visit California 
3 Likes
I have a lot to say about Phylos and cannabis plant patents, Big Pharma and Secret Agent Clarke, etc. but not enough time today, but I will say that while many of the community’s fears are real re: cannabis IP rights, I think Mowgli Holmes is one of the good guys, and so is Rob. And I say that after extensive face-to-face, look 'em in the eye, conversations with both, over a couple of years, as well as with Jeremy Plumb at the Open Cannabis Project, on this subject. (I don’t know Watson, only corresponded a couple of times back in OG 1.0 days, but it seems he and Clarke parted ways some years ago.)
Knowledge is power, and genetic sequencing of cannabis is yielding powerful knowledge - that’s a given. The only real question is who is going to yield the power - and the answer is whoever owns the knowledge: “us” or “them”.
Phylos’ and OCP’s project is basically an international crowdsourcing effort to catalog, with scientific rigor that will stand up to legal challenge, the existing cannabis varieties “in the wild” today. Once that is accomplished, the variety can no longer be “discovered” by Monsanto or Phillip Morris and claimed as an invention - which is exactly the case at the moment, because Prohibition previously made legal recognition of cannabis IP unavailable except for a few hemp varieties.
Phylos, and OCP, with Clarke’s support and promotion, is helping “us” keep existing cannabis varieties as common community assets, owned by everyone and no one, and to lay a framework for breeders to rightfully and authoritatively claim rights for new, significant innovations in the future. That should help non-commercial growers and boutique breeders alike in the long run.
And no, you can’t clone or tissue culture a strain from a leaf punch sent in the mail. Yet.
Peace -b420
17 Likes
sad but true @BloodyAxe. King of frauds.
This videos they shot, “strain hunters” series. I really hope they made adequate financial “donations” to these extremely poor farmers, but I highly doubt it!
Nothing worse than a fraud in cannabis. Its only a matter of time before they do get found out.
Arjan owes Scott aka Shanti for building a multi million dollar empire on Scotts (and others’) work.
5 Likes
I don’t know much about Phylos but I can vouch for them at a personal level after meeting & chatting with them at conventions - they are good people IMO, they aren’t out to screw consumers or this community
3 Likes
Yes Sebring. I hear vape pens equal about 48% of the Cali market. these people care not where
the product comes from, or how its made. I hear its just a mish-mash of shatters blended together most of the time anyways.
The smart consumer knows that a 17% thc cultivar can produce as much, or more pleasant experience than a 32% thc “kush”. Highly analytic.
5 Likes
Most of what I know about Phylos is hearing thru Kevin Jodrey speak on it.
Kevin says he maps out all his keeper stuff. In his case, he says he Phylos’ all his strains as a kind of “protection” and as a “beginning point” of those cultivars.
Kevin’s thinking is to preserve as much as he can, as to have it already mapped in case copyright claims happen, which they will eventually.
Kevin can show he had previous ownership at XX date, which will hopefully keep as much genetic material as we can be open and free sourced.
Like anything I suppose, good things can be used for bad purposes. Gonna be an interesting first decade back into “legalization” as far as genetic material, ownership etc.
3 Likes
anyone see phylos sister company selling all these strains people have sent in?? smart huh? send me all the cuts around the world so i can make bank off them.
5 Likes
If you’re talking about the TC company that is partnering with them, read the statement. They are saying that all of their cultivars are in the Phylos galaxy to prove authenticity.
2 Likes
I hope it’s all in the name off progress but I’m not quite ready to send them anything
Btw if you want to see and hear Mr Dave Watson speak click this link and fast forward to the 1 hr 11min mark
yes. but did you read on where they got these cuts? obv they are in the galaxy because thats how they got all their cuts. people paying them to send them their cuts, thy turn around, TC them and sell them. very smart scam to make bank… and guess who fuckin owns it… lmao
4 Likes
Actually the point with Phylos, BioTech LLC, Skunkman, Chimera and all those cons is totally the opposite… they have been asking for all the rare genetics donations for the Cannabis Evolution project and all that BS. Dead seeds, leafs, whatver, no problem, send all to us…we don’t really want your genetics, it’s for the sake of science Lol.
But the funny thing comes when you realize that neither Skunkman, Chimera and the others have submitted ONE single sample of their HUGE genetic collection, so it’s obvious they don’t have any interest on contributing to it or having their genetics tested and analyzed so we know more about them. When you start thinking about it it starts to make sense, especially when you analize the Cannabis Open Project thing. Of course that’s because they don’t want their genetics to get into the public domain too so they can be the only ones patenting stuff, now they know none of us teh breeders who sent samples will be able to do the same with all the genetics donated for the Phylos Galaxy crap. Nice move.
Chimera is already applying for patents and so is BioTech. Shame on us for trusting a rat like Skunkman. Eventually you realize all the biggest players on the scene (Skunkman, Reeferman, Chimera, Shantibaba, Arjan, Nevil…) were actually bullshit and con artists and opportunists who took advantage on other people while creating their very own legends for us innocent growers to put them into a pedestal.
Peace.
9 Likes
Interesting observations about them not submitting their own stuff to phylos. I’m not really up on the issues here, but it seems to me that maybe someone should start submitting some greenhouse seeds to phylos for them…
3 Likes
Yes, exactly the point. Folks who want existing cannabis cultivars to remain in the public domain support the Open Cannabis Project, and those who want to protect proprietary strains they’ve developed don’t (or the don’t for THEIR strains.) What do Skunkman, Reeferman Chimera or BioTech Institute LLC have to do with Phylos? Proprietary breeders are exactly why we need the OCP and Phylos’ Galaxy project.
Here what Patent Docs, no “weed site” for sure, has to say about the BioTech patent apps in particular:
.…commentators have speculated that Biotech Institute’s patents may cover anywhere from 50-70% of all Cannabis plants that are currently on the market, which could pose a serious threat to many Cannabis growers. Unlike plant patents, which are narrow and cover a particular, well-defined new plant variety, utility patents directed to plants have the potential to claim a much broader range of varieties.
Further, the potential sweeping scope of these patents, specifically, highlights a couple of issues with prosecuting and challenging patents on Cannabis plants, generally. For example, there would seem to be a lack of prior art available showing the particular chemotypes of strains that are currently in use. Without this information, Examiners are unable to accurately determine whether a Cannabis plant with a particular chemotype is novel and nonobvious. Moreover, the lack of publications or information on the Cannabis varieties currently available to the public may pose similar challenges for third parties seeking to initiate certain post-grant review proceedings before the USPTO of patents covering Cannabis plants. Indeed, perhaps unsurprisingly, none of the patents in this family have yet been subjected to an IPR proceeding.
Regardless of this lack of post-grant challenges or proceedings for the Biotech cannabis patents, however, these concerns have become apparent by other market reactions in the industry. For example, in direct response to these issues and Biotech Institute’s patents in particular, groups such as the Open Cannabis Project (“OCP”) are working to catalog and publish the chemotype data of cannabis strains that are currently in the public domain. OCP’s mission, in part, is to prevent broad utility patent protection of Cannabis plants. Having such a database will help ensure that patents on Cannabis plants are properly limited in scope to cover novel and nonobvious varieties.
-b420
11 Likes
Sam the skunkman and Mr Clarke both have samples sent to phylos, go to phylos and search Dave watson ,he has almost 70 submissions but there not being sent to the open source project more likely using the data to back up patent applications
5 Likes