Us government has a patent on just about all medical use of cannabis and its extracts they will give the rights to who they wish and it wont be us. It was filed in 2002
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Look into the lawsuits between united cannabis Corp and pure hemp. Dave has a patent on CBD extraction, he also has one on selfing plants he claims he invented that also. CBD was known and studied before 1930 whe shouldent be able to do this but has alot of support from the powers that be
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Actually Sam didnât send one single sample of his own collection. What he did was collecting all the samples that all the breeders and growers he got in touch with through ICMAG were sending him. Most of the donors who got to know about the DNA project through the forums were sending the old seeds to Samâs address in Amsterdam, then he would send them all to Phylos himself, thatâs why they are all under his name. But the truth is that NONE of those samples came from Sam originally but all the donors who got never credited at Phylos:
[QUOTE=Sam_Skunkman;7884175]
Correct, I just looked at my mail list and did not see you. Charlie with your help has been the biggest donator, Dubi is maybe second with the samples that have been sequenced, again I thank everyone that is trying to help, it takes longer, and is far from perfect but the more samples of landraces, be they Hashish, Ganja, Wild, Hemp, landraces from each traditional Cannabis country the better the Galaxy will become. Then Cannabis relationships and evolution may well begin to be understood. That is what RCC and I are working for.
-SamS
[/QUOTE]
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Chimera is ir was actually working for BioTech Institute LCC. He and Skunkman have been involved in some projects too.
There are some rumours about BioTech or any of its affiliates (Phytecs, Napro Research) being one of the investors behind Phylos. It just stinks whatever the truth is.
Robert Clarke sits on Phylos Scientific Advisory Board. Clarke famously was a member of Hortapharm, which was founded by David Watson. David Watson works closely with Ryan Lee (Chimera) who is employed by Napro Research. Napro Research is owned by BioTech Institute, which has filed for various plant patents.
Mowgli was addressed about this questions on a private forum and he ended dissapearing. Too much pressure I guess. Now after all this years since Sam first came withe DNA Project bullshit truth is finally starting to see some light.
Hereâs another interesting article: The Great Pot Monopoly Mystery | GQ
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That is a slanderous statement unsupported by anything remotely resembling facts.
You keep bringing up Phylos and Biotech Institute as if they are one and the same, without any proof of any relationship whatsoever. We agree on Biotech, and several well-known breeders, who seem to be on a kind of patent land grab of the cannabis genome. Add CBD Crew, see United States Patent_ 9095554.pdf (608.0 KB).
Not one of them has a proven financial relationship with Phylos. Hortapharm is old old news. They made a bunch of Skunk 1 seeds for GW Pharma, lost their cultivation license in Holland, and shut down. Watson and Clarke havenât worked together in over 10 years.
Like I said, cannabis patents are going to happen, and they should for companies that create innovative new hybrids and processes. What Phylos is trying to prevent is genetic âcolonialismâ where any Johnny-come-lately with a lawyer can claim to âdiscoverâ Haze, or worse, as weâve seen in the Biotech utility patents, any strain that produces THC above a certain level, or CBD in a certain range, or extraction methods otherwise known to the rest of us as cannabutter.
If we are going to have any success as a community in preventing this land grab from claiming the decades of common work and discoveries of the community, we have to stop raging blindly at The Man and start using the same tools as our opponents to secure the future of the cannabis genome as an open resource for study, cultivation and use. The fight is on, right now. We need to see our enemies, and our allies, clearly. Peace -b420
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I have no knowledge of patent laws and procedures - but someone told me the US govt. patents on cannabis are not a cause for alarm - this was done to protect private entities from patenting the plants? i.e. making it open source? Is this bullshit?
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Government doing things to protect are rights sounds like bs to me
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Not open source, but yes, to protect discoveries made via publicly funded research by licensing them. This is common outside of cannabis research, and helps keep any one company from monopolizing the research and commercialization of patents. Hereâs a list of cannabis patents available for licensing from the NIH: Search Results | Technology Transfer
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I was just chatting with Ed Rosenthal about this last week - mainly the patenting of elite cannabis strains by big Canna Corps. Ed, who does a fair amount of consulting with large licensed grow ops in CA, dismissed the concern that some of the favorite strains will be âstolenâ and removed from public use.
He said that what he is seeing is the companies that want to sell flower are breeding their own strains, where they can document ownership and work done on the strain to make a clear case for uniqueness and âartâ (the documentation needed to prove you invented something).
And those who want to produce THC for distillates, which has quickly become 50% of the recreational market and virtually all of the medicinal market, just want THC pumps, whether its Super Skunk or some GMOâd Frankenplant like THC-producing yeast. Just like McDonalds has its own potato variety because it freezes well, or Perdue itâs own chickens because they grow twice as fast as other breeds. These guys could give a f**k about the terpene profile of your Ultra Cookie Berry Kush - if they need orange terpenes, theyâll buy them from the Sunkist processor.
Welcome to industrial cannabis. Canât wait for the cinnamon pumpkin sativa carts to hit the Starbudâs in OctoberâŚ
Me and Ed R, Oakland, California 2018
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Hereâs a link for the process Iâm most familiar with in strain creation and ownership.
I thought this was a good read as well regarding nomenclature.
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Hmmm. Phylos creates a sterile plant cloning from tissue culture program.
Phylos, âLearn about our new plant breeding program, coming spring 2019.â
The network of small breeders and family farms who founded the cannabis industry is still the best hope for preserving the genetic diversity of cannabis.
Weâve helped launch Conception Nurseries, a clone nursery pioneering a transparent supply chain that supports fair credit and fair royalty payments for breeders. Conception will bring new cannabis varieties to market as sterile clones grown from tissue culture and will be a powerful path to market for breeders of all sizes. Conception will offer vigorous and pathogen-free plantlets at costs lower than in-house production.
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fuckn Frankenbuds are here!!!
the cunts can switch off genetic material within the plant, causing it to be sterile.
Fuck them, boycott their shit. just like in Canada. If they are sketchy motherfuckers, dont be buying their shit. Buy from the quality cannabis grower down the road, who still has a family to feed.
Or better yet, if possible in your locality, to grow your own cannabis.
The Canadian weed game is corrupt as the day is long. The Govt made the fees just to apply so expensive that it cut out 99% of the cannabis population. Only those with big backing will get a seat at the Canadian cannabis table, not you or I.
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Damn Canadian companies! Just bought 1 of 15 licenses in my state for $40- $50mill. Bought from a nursery that had every dollar saved wrapped up into it, but the state was fucking around w âlegalitiesâ effectively forcing family to sell. All legal grows will be corporate when legalization hits the states. RIP in pieces to small business ventures⌠and just to stay on topic⌠FUCK PHYLOS AND SKUNKMAN SAM (But donât forget to send your cuts guys we are legit)
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iâve been wondering about these Phylos guys also.
im still not patenting anything. weed is for the people.
If i didnt want my genes out there, I wouldnt sell seeds, lol.
Iâm curious if anyone has used phylos? I mean anyone thatâs not a huge company⌠Phylos setup a âsmall growers networkâ, so it seems they are wanting more hobby growers to submit stuff. Im not sure about thisâŚ
I believe 100% that the worlds needs a compendium or encyclopedia of modern weed (1968-ish to present) and fully support efforts to do so. We need it for education sake and for posterity.
That being said, I dont agree with some of phylos methods, such as charging for all submissionsâŚ
I get it, that if i owned a store and i wanted extra paperwork to help sell my weed, of course i would pay for their services. In that case, i would be needing them.
But, like most breeders, I have strains that they need for their baseline. Without key building blocks of modern weed (landrace samples from all 6 continents, [they already have early califonia with sams gear], TSB gear especially their NL line, TFD the pure [they have samâs #1, but eddies was also used in Holland, so was The Shit], Sag Slyder, SSSC gear etc), all they will ever have will be a bunch of strains with gaps between them and a galaxy that doesnât make any sense.
I would like to see a weed galaxy that is an actual family tree and one that is legible. I want to look up NL#5 and it says: Afghani from âinsert Long/Lat coordinatesâ, crossed with Indonesian from âinsert longitude/latitude coordinatesâ. You know what i mean? Providing relatives is only part of the picture. Itâs vital to list parents and offspring, as well as siblings and relatives. Parents should have the greatest detail. its the only way to distinguish from one version of a strain from another.
I donât mind donating free samples of genetic material for a public record, like for history and posterity. But if any money changes hands at all, they should be paying me. Because they would be using my data to expand their database and thus indirectly profit off of it. Rather than if i had a store and I used their data to sell my weed, ya know what I mean?
The Doctor Dank and I are just two dudes in a world of growers and if we have a few classics, imagine how much more there is out there. There has to be thousands of small people all over the world who are also holding heirloom genes. Some where, somebody has some ultra rare or thought-to-be-extinct genes in their closet.
Im sure folks could be persuaded to donate for posterity, for the greater good, but I doubt anyone small, would ever pay to playâŚ
The other issue I have is there Population Profile baseline graph thing⌠the âstrainsâ they use are a mix of hybrids, originals and general terms, that dont make sense. Sk is great to use as a defining category. But âberryâ is a flavour, lol and âlandraceâ can mean anything from a tall brazilian to a short kyhber afghan⌠OG kush is a polyhybrid strain, not one of the original starting points, its not even a grandparent hybrid. its a great great grandchild of something⌠it would come way farther down on a family tree. Instead of OG youâd list one of its parents.
CBD should be separate from Linnaeus. There MUST be a clear distinction between high-CBD strains that have been bred down from the THC side, versus the hemp Linnaeus. There should be 6 categories (1 for each continent for landraces) and 3 subcategories for 1969-present hybrids. it should be Haze, Skunk and NL.
U want to start with Chinese regional strains. And from there go to the first landraces which were strains that the Chinese exported and âdriftedâ or evolved into distinct varieties unto themselves. From there u go onto what led to what we know as weed today. california 1960âs-1980, into Holland and Canada. from there its considered modern weed and we get the 3 branches that most laymen have used as a separator and classification for decades: Haze, NL and Skunk. , Obviously there is room for insanely indepth tangents on every single level of the journey from Chinese âhempâ farmers to cultivators choice printing a seed catalogue in 1981, for example, but i have no issue with superficially simplifying it as long there are clickable links at each level that will allow u to see all the way back to ancient china if u want to.
If everything nowadays has chemdawg in it (anything with any diesel, og, cookies, etc has chemdawg in it),then break it down to its parents (such as TSB indi-sat crossed with thai or mexican) and list Chemdawg as a 4th category division, alongside Haze, NL and SkunkâŚ
I just dont like phylos categories of Landrace, Berry, CBD, SK and OG. it doesnt make any sense, categorically speaking.
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Watson posted in IcyMaggy (where he is a moderator) that he has over a metric ton of Cannabis seeds frozen someplace. That is a lot of frikkenâ seeds. Not sure of his sources of them. Rob Clarke is an old buddy of Watson and is on the board at Phylos. He also has a large stash of seeds posted there. Back in the day, Mel Frank was the one with the seed collection. He says that he had over 200 landraces in Oakland. He was the roommate of Ed Rosenthal at that time.
The issue with Phylos is the validity of their samples. What is the baseline that they are using? As said above, berry, skunk, OG, these are arbitrary and meaningless. There are a lot of skunks out there. Never mind landraces. OG/Chem is in just about every new strain now.
The Phylos prices are too steep for amateur growers and seed collectors to submit samples. Also patents are not good on any seeds bred in the US unless they are GMO. The only plants you could patent in the US are clones of one mother. Every seed is a unique plant, and thus seeds from any strain are not patentable. Not that you can patent plants with it being a Sched. 1 drug. The USDA will not allow it. They will be starting to allow HEMP clones to be patented now that it is legal in the US. It will be a while before they and the FDA get the hemp laws and regs ramped up.
There is new archeological evidence that Cannabis migrated west a lot longer ago than previously thought. Like 8,000 years ago in Romania along the Danube River, and 5,000 years ago it was grown in Italy. These were grown in cleared fields. So going back you will likley have to differentiate by regions of North Africa, Sub-Sahara Africa, the MIiddle East, South Europe, South Asia, Asia -istan countries, Southeast Asia, China, Central Asia, and the Himalayas. We are still not sure when or where Colombian landraces came from. Or where Mexico landraces come from. Mexican are more closely related to South India, and Colombian are more closely related to SE Asia. Newer breeds (even those from Holland) came mostly from the west coast of the US. They were mostly hybrids of Afghanis and Mexican, South and SE Asian, Colombian, Thai and African strains. Some like White Widow were direct hybrids of Brazil and South India strains. So I think that you have to go to regional landraces to establish a baseline. But that varies as you go farther back in time.
Hemp strains also have a deep history to Northern Europe. Genetically they are different than the drug cultivars. New genetics shows that Cannabis species should be split between North Eurasian hemp strains (including ruderalis) and all the drug cultivars (sativa and indica). Splitting the Cannabis species as they are now is a bad model. But that is what most use.
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The Phylos Galaxy takes a bit to get your head around. Iâve spoken to Mowgli Holmes about this at length. Itâs not a âfamily treeâ showing lineage. Phylos makes no claims regarding lineage - which came before what, what is the parent or child of any âstrainâ. In fact, Mowgli has said publicly that he doesnât believe âstrainsâ exist in modern drug cannabis. He calls them âclonal groupsâ because of the large role elite clones have played and still do play in cannabis breeding, and the complete lack of professional discipline in naming conventions regarding new varieties.
The Galaxy merely expresses the relative genetic similarity of different individuals scanned into their database. The more similar the genetic code, the closer they exist to each other in the Galaxy. Regardless of their given names or commonly reputed lineage.
The Galaxy names represent clusters of multiple samples with similar genetic markers and similar names - but the clustering is gene-based, not name based. Hence, East Coast Sour Diesel and New York Sour Diesel sit far apart from each other, when most would consider them close relatives. The genes say otherwise, even if the resulting varieties are similar.
Given the complete orgy of polyhybridizing that passes for the modern cannabis breeding today, ignoring the seedmaker folklore of lineage and idiosyncratic generational naming to start fresh with a science-based approach makes a lot of sense IMO. -b420
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Phylos is now starting a breeding program.
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Check out an excellent video by Matthew Riot he made the other day, on YT. He has a genomics guy on to discuss whats going onâŚ
Also, Adam Dunn had a show on last nite too which was informative. It can be found on YT too.
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Thanks, here is the direct link to the YT video:
And, the Phylos presentation:
And, the interview with Adam Dunn:
Follow-up on the Adam Dunn interview:
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