Sure has…It is not the same place anymore.
Think he started a smoke club out in Ibiza last I heard, Don’t know how that went for him.
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Hiya,
Here is a snippet of a pm I sent to Jaws:
SmellyBerry was made as a gift for me by ot1. He pollinated my blues/livers clone with one of his favourite Blueberry males. The Blueberry came from the very first release by DJ Short via Heavens Stairway, around 1999 iirc.
I selected the most blues dominant male I found from the SmellyBerries and bx’d it back to Blues to make KillerSkunk.
In 2008 I released KillerSkunk. I spent the following couple of years growing KillerSkunk and isolating my favourite, most stable males before performing a bx2.
The bx2 were super homogeneous, I grew a lot of them out at scale and they grew like clones. I decided to release that as Blues in 2010.
In 2013 I released UGORG#1. I used the original Cheese clone which came from cheese_farmer via Ot1.
I also released PsychoSister that year, which was the original Psychosis clone x the same Blues male I used to make UGORG#1.
Shortly after releasing KillerSkunk oldtimer1 came to me and asked if I would consider selling his seeds under my brand. I was both shocked and honoured. He had been sending them in to Joolz to sell via the uk420 shop for a couple of years and never received a penny in return! At that point in time, he hadn’t been paid for a single seed he had sent. The deal was 50% but he had received nothing. He was really upset and disappointed(as you can imagine) and told me there and then to never, ever let myself fall into the same trap.
When oldtimer1 passed away I asked to be removed from the modroom, after 20 years of service. I just didn’t agree with a lot of the decisions he was making in Ot’s absence. He was letting some really horrible people run a mock there, dragging what we had all built together through the gutter. The place was un moderated and becoming unrecognisable by the day.
During the lockdowns he used his platform to promote the government terror narrative, including promotion of the vaccine and deleted posts(and banned a few members!) by anyone offering a differing perspective. It was supposed to be a counter culture website but people were being censored for speaking their truth.
2 weeks after taking his booster shot, whilst acting as the primary carer for his sick wife oldtimer1 passed away from a massive stroke. Joolz continued to use his platform to promote the vaccine and censor anyone who dared speak out against it. 
As a result, I was barely going on there anymore. Last August we attended product Earth festival, it was a weekend trade show. When I returned home on the Monday morning I had received an e-mail from Joolz notifying me I’d been banned from the website for spamming, I hadn’t been on there for months at this point.
He was claiming I owed him money for advertising, he never once sent me an invoice or made me aware of it. Instead, he used the modroom(which I could no longer access) to claim to the moderators, in an attempt to rally support from them, that I owed him money. I will say it again, he never once notified me, instead he chose to make the claim behind my back. This is after 20 years of service.
He then deleted my entire forum which had 15 years of my work documented, thousands of testimonials, half a million posts, 10’s of thousands of images and thousands of posts by my best friend oldtimer1.
As you can imagine, all the long standing real members left. Now you just have a handful of really crappy people making rip-off copies of my work on damp windowsills and sending them in to Joolz to ‘support the site’ so he can sell them on to the members at £25 a go to pay his bills. I have no doubt that when we were all still there, the hosting was expensive but based on the current level of traffic, or lack of it, it can’t be costing much more than £20 a month to host it.
He has always been into selling seeds but never been into paying for them. Anyone that’s been around long enough is fully aware of this, and that’s why there’s nobody with a shred of integrity left there.
It’s really sad, I invested a lot there and to have it all taken away from me in such a way, shortly after losing one of my best friends was beyond shady as fuck… it was heart breaking.
I’m a real person, not a phony internet character / keyboard warrior so you are all more than welcome to come chat with me at any trade show, event etc and look me in the eye, everything I’ve said is the truth.
Re: Silas. I only met him once but I was really good friends with his little brother and sent him a lot of seeds over the years. As far as I’m aware, he simply crossed my plants together and promoted them on a different forum.
Thanks for the concern @funkyfunk but I’m doing as well as ever, thanks. I’m in an extremely fortunate position due to the fact I actually did and continue to do the work. So I have a lot of loyal returning customers from as long as 15 years ago, which means I don’t and never have had to advertise anywhere.
We contributed far more than we ever took from that website and a casual glance over there just now, will more than prove that point entirely, unrecognisable barely even covers it.
FWIW re: this thread, I still have all the original plants I used backed up in multiple locations. I’ve just been far too busy with other projects to be constantly re-making seeds but, I will be making a concerted effort to make them all available again for everyone, hopefully sometime in the near future.
Apologies for the length of this post but I felt like it was finally the time to outline for everyone what actually happened there, draw a line under it and keep moving forwards.
OT1 FOREVER IN MY HEART! 
FromTheUndergroundWithLove, VRG.
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Good to hear from you VRG. The work you do/did is well respected and I am sure you know folks look up to it. I’ll keep quiet on the V front so as not to fuffle fearhers here but I have a also a few stories.
BTW uk420 was always full of cunts ( with the exception of a few(
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When you have the likes of jaws throwing your stuff against every cookie and wedding cake going thats a good sign lol
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Despite me finding you hard to interact with sometimes at UK420 VRG under the name I used there as noted above I always respected you for your work, I loved the bones of OT and he embraced you and your work and thats all that really matters now. I did not stick around after he passed and was barely there as it was.
It has totally changed for the worse at UK420, It was not right what happened with you. Last time I was there most of the member seeds for Subs was all knock off UGORG gear.
I am glad your still up and at it, Just the other day I found a song that reminded me of you. Elders by Clouds as I remember you recommending the track.
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Thanks @VRG, that’s a great testimony . Explains a lot. I’m glad you join the thread and put a bit of perspective. Hope you appreciate your work still lives in places like here. That’s sad that many stuffs were deleted. Good news is you’re still active 
The UK420 shop or the subscription has nothing really appealing nowadays anyway
I regret I couldn’t cross the path of oldtimer1, he’s been a great source of inspiration and looked like a great guy.
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It was difficult there because I was having to fight so many battles at once. The place was always infested with trolls and underachievers, lurking in the shadows and throwing stones, just now all the good people left they have centre stage.
They begrudged both my success and my relationship with Ot1, in the belief that they could’ve, should’ve, would’ve done it better…
Which makes it quite frankly pathetic at this stage that the best they’ve been able to offer since I’ve left, has been to simply cross the plants I made together, and rename them.
Rather than creating something of their own, which clearly isn’t happening because that means doing some actual work. Work that quite simply cannot be achieved with a 1 man tent and a windowsill. I know this might upset a few people but it still remains as a fact.
Also, what I will say is that I didn’t go looking for or searching for any of these plants. Rather they all found me. All were passed to me in good faith, by good people, and with provenance.
I personally took on the responsibility to care for them and preserve them for everyone. Now fast forward 15 years and everyone has a cheese, blues, psychosis clone… but 99% of them came from the seeds I made.
This is a fact and no doubt we will get a barrage of people claiming to hold the originals(even if they can offer absolutely nothing in terms of provenance) I have no doubt a handful still do but, what I will say is where the fuck are they? because I haven’t seen a sample of any of them that wasn’t grown by me or one of my friends for well over a decade and I have been actively attending events all over europe in that time.
I’m sure Jaws will confirm, quite literally everybody has a cheese clone but at the same time nobody actually has a cheese clone. It was difficult to source an original 15 years ago, I can only imagine the mine field you’re facing today.
Thank you @Even @Haggis @funkyfunk onwards and upwards !
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I think the fact you where stressed most likely contributed to my appraisal of your attitude at times. Which given now I know what was going on behind the scenes was a touch unfair on my part. So please take an apology for my previous harsh remark.
I never understood that out and out hate club, But me and you both know that non of them could even touch OTs natural latent talent for breeding and he clearly seen that in you or he would not have trusted you.
I can remember him ribbing you lightly in a thread after you had visited him, Over the fact you did not voice up and tell him you dislike tomatoes when he was offering up some of his 
He was a funny old bugger at times.
I’ll never forget that avatar someone made for him using a childhood picture, The hair growing on 5yr old OT as he puffed a joint 
Always the way sadly. Can you remember the first wave of the cheese madness where everyone suddenly had a cheese cut after Milo crossed it with an affie despite the fact Milos barely resembled Cheese.
God only knows I’ve not seen Cheese, Blues nor Psychosis cuttings doing the rounds in my neck of the woods in an absolute age. Just cuttings from crosses all from I suspect Yours, Milos and Kes/Kevs work with those various cuttings over the years.
Anyhoo I am going to stop now as thinking about OT and what happened is bumming me out and no doubt bumming you out.
Best of luck VRG
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Whatever about all the other people, I hope you carry on your work , don’t even stress it.
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man im even more sad now after reading this that my gorg and blues did not take for me this time round. i think the seeds were just to old to pop, more so on the blues but ya both never really took off for me. i have a few more of each and will FOR-SURE give the others ago.
my new exodus cheese cut.
was really really wanting to hit this cut with gorg and blues males, still want to but it will have to wait now until i get more of both going. im hoping i can get some of the remaining seeds to not openly germ for me but also show me some willingness to grow for me over here.
we shall see …
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I just popped a pack of blues t’other day. All but one showed good healthy long roots in a water and 3% h2o2 bath. Maybe a different pack and you’ll have a change of luck.
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…. As of this morning they’ve all broken the surface of the coco 
…. Had a couple of seedlings not emerge and noticed springtails in the coco when I had a root around so I was hoping the blues would be okay … 11/11 …
As for uk420 I was a bit of an arsehole towards vrg. I was weak and dog piled like a loser. I shouldn’t have done it even though it was just one angry post. So to that end I apologise.
I’ve since been put on the naughty step because of a political difference of opinion myself. Mods don’t moderate. They get TOO involved in discourse and sanitise the place of any difference of opinion. Having your own opinion is one thing. Enforcing it with moderator privileges is another. Basically they want to live in primary school forever where we all still drink milk and take naps. So I asked for my profile to be deleted. It’s the same 4/5 voices dominating then chasing folk around being passive aggressive in order to get a rise out of folk. Including moderators.
So now I’m no longer blinded by my allegiances I’ll be popping all my ugorg and I’ll be feeding them growers ark.
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Welcome @LumpyMashedTaity, the atmosphere is clearly different here, hope you’ll enjoy it. Keep us updated about your blues!
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Cheers @funkyfunk I’ll certainly do that. I’ll pop a few pics up n that when there’s something worth looking at.
I’ve also got 2 x Ugorg#1 F2, UgorgBX1, Premier Sweet and a pack of Nonames left. No point keeping things back to go off so I’ll be doing a pack a run from here on in.
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ahh man im so stoked to hear ya got decent germ rates, mine were not wanting to play sadly. i have a few more of each and will attempt them again this year.
AHHH ok so where did you get the UGORG F2 & UGORG BC1 and are there still some around that ppl can get there hands on ???.
nice …
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Sometimes pollen or snips can fly thousands of kilometer 
Think I’ve read about BC1 on UK420 long time ago. There seem to be some recent activity around UGORG beans, but searching through their new forum is a pain.
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not sure if i ever been to that site, i might have at some point.
think i’ll just stick with talking to @VRG on anything UGORG related.
peace …
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That sounds like a wise take on it
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@JAWS Vrg was giving out blues as freebies so I ended up with 3 packs. This was the last pack I have. Putting them in the hands of a beginner like me at the time only sealed their fate. It was reading this thread that made me want to pop them.
If I’d have thought on I’d have rather donated them to you because I’ve only really got 3 years of growing under my belt which is naff all really.
I bought the F2’s off their website and the BX1 I was gifted by VRG for a review on the Discobiscuit I’d grown. Maybe this will jog VRG’s memory and he might think I’m a right twat but may he without sin …. Anyway, apologies VRG.
Are you interested in the F2’s? I’m not really in or into cannabis culture as much as most forum folk so I dunno what’s rare or sought after. I just know what I like. There’s 2 packs of F2’s there. They weren’t cheap either and I’m poor. If I sent them to I’m sure you’d appreciate them much more than I would. Somethings are worth more than money innit.
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Wow, awesome thread! Dunno how I missed it thus far. Awesome Cheese discussion happening here.
I love Cheese, but being in Canada I figure I’ve probably never had the real deal. I imagine most of what we get over here is derivative of the Big Buddha stuff. If its not too much of a thread de-rail maybe someone can help me interpret my different Cheese experiences and what they might be. Almost everything here is labelled “UK Cheese”.
So this is what went around my area (Vancouver, BC) as Cheese back in the day. Had a powdered cheese type aroma like the packet of cheese powder that comes in a box of mac and cheese. Long lasting high. I’m 90% sure this is Big Buddha cheese as its has rounded bud structure, all green buds, orange hairs and large spongey sort of buds:
From what I’ve seen of “real” cheese its very dense, more fox-tail prone, some purple and a bit of a different look to it. Lots of times with those shell like stacked calyx’s.
So I’ve personally grown
Cannacopia Cheese x Deep Chunk:
This one I figure was made with the legit Cheese or at least something close to the Exodus Cheese cut because it had the fox tails and a lot of that creamy funk I believe the real Cheese has. Was like creamy, earthy, cheesy funk. Like cheesecake made from potting soil with some blueberries mixed in haha.
GHS Exodus Cheese:
I had three plants from this. One tall, Skunk 1 type think that took 10 weeks and had floral, earthy and almost fruity buds with a nice sativa high. One weird minty runt thing and then this cheesy one I kept for a couple rounds that is pictured here. She grew slow, and if topped at all grew out like a carpet w/ very floppy stems. Would not grow upright at all really. Floppy horizontal growth with zig zag stems like Apollo 11 style. She has a wonderful creamy, foot funk, earthy, berry, skunky nose.
Finally, Old School from Ripper seeds which is Cheese x Black Domina:
This one had much more upright growth. Very very nice aroma. Doesn’t smell like weed at all really. The same creamy cheescakey vibe as the others but much less earthy, much less funk, almost all creamy cheese cake with a plethora of floral berries and other interesting non-cannabis smells. Probably the most interesting smelling cannabis I’ve ever grown.
So what do you think? Think these ones I’ve grown are all hybrids or descendants of the real Cheese? Do any of my descriptions ring true to the real deal Cheese, or lean towards any of the particular cuts or lines that have been discussed in this thread?
One thing I’ll say for sure is just how all of these Cheese hybrid plants smell vastly different to almost all other cannabis I’ve grown. It’s a fascinating genepool for sure
I also have a 5 pack of @santero Froot Punch which is described as:
“Froot Punch” = Homeless Larry X Cheetos
the HL and cheetos are made by yours truly.
‘homeless larry’ was the exodus cheese to a f1 lemon larry male from
elite genetics release and ‘cheetos’ is the same exodus cheese lady to
the sour diesel ibl 2010 male that i found in a pack send over by bodhi.
(from the time i had my chocolate thai and chocolate diesel-adventures)
FP is cheese-dom and easy to grow, strong punch and sweet fruity taste.
takes up to 9, but most are done in 8 weeks, check your filters b4 growing.
these plants will stink…
SO its 50% Exodus Cheese, mixed with OG and Sour. So I’m excited to look through those beans for sure.
Finally, is there any currently available seeds that might give me a more authentic pure Cheese experience than what I’ve posted thus far? Lots of great discussion in here about things available in the past and privately but if there’s anything public, I would be very interested!
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