Why not they’re making their money and nobody to the wiser till I brought it up.
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Believe he’s saying something to the affect of:
Find your p1’s and then find a recessive and/or mutant plant. Breed the recessive to your p1’s and then using the right selection you can breed F1s that look good, but when you breed those F1s together for F2s you’ll pretty much only get that recessive pheno.
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Who are these breeders?
How are they somehow “breeding in bad traits to their lines to discourage F2” without ruining the F1?
What specific traits are they “breeding in”?
Why is it when I grow F2’s of other breeders work, they’re good plants?
What can you tell us, anything at all, to support this audacious claim, motz?
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That would mean that every breeder allegedly doing this is actually selling what we could call “F2”. Which isn’t the case at all. If this were true the “F1” would be full of mutants. Recessive traits are recessive for a reason they don’t just suddenly all pop up in the second generation, even if they carried the recessive trait. You’d still see it in the F1.
Trust me no one is putting in anywhere near this level of work, and it’s not really within the realm of possible for any of us. It’s usually just male to elite clone these days. Perhaps if the claimants of this could point to a single breeder doing this we could work from there a bit lol.
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It’s not a claim, it happens.
You think every breeder gives out the goodies it dont happen like that.
There is people out there who believe what they have is theirs and yes they don’t mind sharing to a point.
Man I have nothing else to prove, Google it for yourself instead of searching the porn sites doing one handed typing.
Learn something for a change before opening your yap, makes ya look sad.
It’s not that tough to do.
Long story short, you made up a breeding conspiracy and now have nothing to support the claim.
Yawn.
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Whatever you think Vernie you’re the resident know it all.
Alway come across that way.
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In Chapter 12 of “The Cannabis Breeder’s Bible”, Greg Green discusses the topic of how to protect your work. If I’m not mistaken, he is talking about the same thing as in the discussion here.
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When I breed cannabis I make sure every third generation comes out as dandelions.
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I know one thing, and that’s poly “breeders” aren’t doing it now. They can’t even be bother to grow their own work before it goes to market lol. Fat chance their unstablilized parents have any stabilized recessive trait. Their protection is a shit show of phenos in the F1 gen and a shit show squared if F2ed.
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The fast lines are one quick example of how F2s would be vastly different and unstable from the parents used to breed them. 1/4 of them could be autos.
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The “F1” seeds you’d be buying would also carry the autoflowering trait, which is generally dominant.
Again, if anyone can name 1 specific breeder doing this, and specifically how…
The closest thing that breeders do is sell feminized seeds which are difficult to make more of, but they mostly do it in response to customer demand. Fems sell. Even then, occasionally you get males.
The “F2” is naturally more all over the place phenotypically than a true F1. This isn’t new and controversial or shady breeding. It’s just like that for all breeding, including Cannabis. Thing is, hardly anyone is starting from actual F1 hybrids so moot point.
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I think auto is recessive, but also I don’t think “fast” versions are necessarily intended to screw people if F2ed, even though you’d find auto genetics.
More importantly, recessive traits only show up 50% at best in an F2 generation, if they aren’t present in F1. It’s easy to select away from them, so I don’t consider that any kind of real protection anyway. Also, if you really cared, just clone from F1 and run it as much as you want, or select an F2 and backcross to your F1 selection, or any number of ways to get around it.
Besides all of that, nearly 100% of seed “strains” produced now have zero lasting value, because the market has ADD and breeders are just trying to get seeds out as fast as possible and get money while the getting is good. Every time I look at a seedbank in the US, it’s hard to find anything that has parents of inbred stock… even to F2. Any strain development work for the most part isn’t happening for the majority of seeds listed.
Any breeder right now that puts more than pollen chucking level effort into their seeds is strictly doing it for the passion of breeding. The money is being spread thin across an increasing number of seed sellers who put out 10 “strains”, 4 times a year, and couldn’t even tell you what is unique or special about any one of them.
It’s hard for me to imagine that someone feels that’s worth protecting.
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You say you were doing this in the 80’s…
Can you tell us how you went about doing it?
I’m VERY curious
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That’s not how empirical data works. That’s just an anecdote, at best.
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This should be one post and done. There’s no reason if you’re being honest it needs to be dragged out like this.
And please, don’t take this as a bunch of people ganging up on you. You made a crazy claim and you should have expected us to call you in it
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This is gonna be like Geraldo Rivera and Al Capone’s vault. Big ol’ bag of nothing.
I’d bet my house on it.
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Huge buildup to nothing. Opening Capone’s Cell.
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Some of the seed breeders do misrepresent just what they have as a genetic, a lot claim f1 but arnt true f1s