What are your latest seed purchases? Post those new packs & purchase info here

[FieldEffect]

What a fantastic reply! I appreciate you taking the time to write this up.

Out of curiosity what lines other than California Indica and Big Bud have you really surveyed?

So, if I’m reading right it sounds like the original P1 generations are typically gone and we’re getting F2-ish stuff with huge variation and a minority representation of the original F1 seeds sold 20 years ago. I imagine this is likely the case with many of the Dutch breeders selling the “same” seeds for 20+ years.

Maple leaf indica is just Ortega? I already have that from FDM. I thought MLI was a hybrid of several Afghan varieties, not just a rebadge Ortega. To clarify, Ortega is a hybrid, but I thought MLI was a cross with Ortega as only one of the parents. Hmmm

Maybe I’ll have to run at least those two. I’ll see if I can get the Mr. Nice version as well.

Thanks again @Fuel!

[Fuel]

Better to list what i’ve not grown&smoked from them : Ed Rosenthal Super bud, Jamaican Pearl, the ruderalis crosses, Eagle Bill and American Dream. During this time some have disappeared that i’ve not tested, like the strain named after the writer’s woman that love hash as fuck, i forgot the name. Or have changed label, like the master kush now on white label. On the other side of the list, I’ve only inbred an half dozen on the total tested (by choice)

This year unfortunately, it’s limited to two strains from them that I was forced to grow twice in a row. I’m quite stressed for the Jack Herer and the NL5 x Haze, a bit less for the Shiva Shanti II that are in the fridge atm. The three are fresh from the year at least.

I’m angry to see this devastation but it’s also a part of my teenage age, culturally i mean. It can look weird today with the insane offer, but at this time we had not much diversity outside personal crosses, but the plants was just amazing. Directly i mean. To see these plants so fucked by herms and variegations is almost physically painful.

I tried to understand the fallout, and even with good contacts i only got theories and nothing reliable to explain this drastic change in the quality/price. I’m just able to recognize this kind of drift because I’ve made more fems that i wished to make years ago. Another ambivalence lol I don’t know why the hell the lead breeding used a S1 to replace one P1 of the these distant releases that are the Big Bud and the California Indica. Even if you’re screwed by a lost of a motherplant it’s always possible to work from the F1 in maintaining a certain quality. But you have to stop to sell it a time for this …

I personnally think it’s more a question of logistic and the difficulty to send cuts to distant production units, something in this vein. Understand cost compression, overall. And not specially the rumor saying everybody losted the motherplants like a normal grower. We are talking about wealthy companies, common nurseries and about also the pioneers of the seed’s industry. Not about a random fresh breeder devastated by spider mite or any case imagined at the scale of an homegrown setup.

Huge variations, no. I can even put the AK47 in the case (actually growing aside the Calindi), suffering exactly from the exact same symptoms. Wounded is the best word to describe it.

Minority representation of the original F1 seeds, not even too. It’s why it’s so complicated to describe the situation. Phenos still around, but more than ever you need luck and sometimes to try again to dodge bullets ^^

Seeds sold 20 years ago : the quality is concerned. Then the price. Of seeds themselves (look at my last order ^^) but also of the state of the genetic. It’s more like a champion of athleticism, but full of scars, with asthma and the heart fucked by steroids. And the first repro is quite narrowed around the dominant presence of herms, it’s why i say you have to think twice to reproduce it. You need a solid plan to heal them, and get back the shine. And to launch aside something that can eventually save your ass if you don’t get any decent pairing to keep it pure. It was Nirvana 20 years ago, but for 100 seeds at 150€ ^^

It’s not different than in past, i do the same thing in “adopting the line” and driving it to my preferences. It’s just freaking hard now and eat a few generation before really entering in selection. It mean that you eat seeds like an ogre too. It change the constraints drastically, i’ve to grow these lines like i grow risky landraces lol

I simplify but yes, MLI is the same bud and plant that the Ortega. Now you will encounter different print-foot among the different sources, it stay a living material and not an algorithm that you can copy/paste. For me it’s even more simpler, it’s a Nothern Light blend like there is a ton. Take the Black Domina by example, it’s in the same category for me … just a NL. Yes the smoke is a bit diffferent, but come on … it’s a variation of the same chemotype, the plant grow the same with the same shape, and they react almost the same in outcrosses even used in BX or for fems ^^. At one point of advanced similarity, you can’t say to someone exploring that he will have a totally different experience among these lines lol, it’s lying.

Now i understand totally the people defending the triumvirat individually, the #1, the #2 and the #5. These cuts are specific and i agree that we can’t mix everything in simplification for this specific case. I’m just not enough fascinated and/or involved by the subject at this point.

[funkyfunk]

@Fuel

It’s more like a champion of athleticism, but full of scars, with asthma and the heart fucked by steroids

Twenty years for an annual is a lot

[FieldEffect]

Again, I’m thankful for the thoughtful reply.

@Fuel

Wounded is the best word to describe it.

@Fuel

Then the price. Of seeds themselves (look at my last order ^^) but also of the state of the genetic. It’s more like a champion of athleticism, but full of scars, with asthma and the heart fucked by steroids.

@Fuel

It’s just freaking hard now and eat a few generation before really entering in selection

Good summary of the state of it, and insight that hasn’t been so clearly presented to me before.

Thank you for the disambiguation of the MLI/Ortega. Understand your take that it is broadly the same as other NL-based things. I do love Black Domina. Ortega is a specific blend that I want to grow in particular, if only for fundamentally sentimental reasons. It’s one of the ones that stood out to me in the Cannabible or the Sensi website circa 2003 when I was smoking and considering growing. Like Blueberry or Indiana Bubblegum. It’s on the bucket list, and I want to get as close as I can, and fundamentally I do like the families. Perhaps that’s a totally non-sensical line of reasoning, but I’ll at least grow the FDM Ortega. I’m quite curious what the differences between the “print-foot” of different sources look like. If only to learn more about the plant and behaviors. You have a lot of experience not many have. It helps to read but seeing it across real plants is a whole different thing.

I am curious about the Jack Herer and NL5 Haze you have in the fridge. If you are annoyed by the drift and uncertainty why wouldn’t you just source different stock to start with? I’d expect small preservationists like yourself will be doing a better, more time-consuming job of preserving the line than Sensi is. Which is a totally different topic - I’m with you totally that Sensi SHOULD be doing a much better job for the price (and their reputation, and ethics or lack thereof) - but they aren’t. For example, AK Bean Brains has a NL5 x Haze, that’s where I’d be starting my search. Or start over with a NL5 and cross to a Haze from scratch. Is that misguided? Certainly you’ll never get identical parents to the original, I get that, but perhaps it’s in the same vein as the NL internal crosses like Black Domina and Ortega being in the same category.

Cheers!

[SEMOActivist]

MTG Seeds 369 (Lineage: Durban Poison x Turbo Diesel) On MTG’s site it has this same cross listed as Durban Turbo. Would the 369 be an older tester pack of seeds?

The freebie sounds good, Cross of the Titans F3 bred by 42

[Fuel]

No purpose, just to make the post less arid ^^ Yes i’m european, i use tabacco lol For my defense it’s Backwoods tobacco (the pouch not the cigars), quite neutral with weed.

And i appreciate this chit chat a lot buddy, for one time i don’t meet a parrot on this subject and you look like involved in your choices. I appreciate equally.

I’m glad you took my simplification well, in the right sense of my sensibility with the NL. It have a more rational explanation : specifically my past “fanboyism” with Sensi Seeds. The catalog output singular weed even for the skunks. A skunk#1, a super skunk and a sensi skunk are totally similar but offer different variations that are not psychological. But overall when you had your journey with them (Sensi), you really feel the overuse of the NL1 in the whole catalog (that i knew as cut back then). This is the print-foot i was talking about.

So it’s something i’m naturally screening out in selection with all Sensi lines because i like my NL assumed lol, full throttle. Like a Black Domina or even their Northern Light (blend again), now i always preferred the NL#5 too and it permit make a loop. Now let’s be bitchy a bit now, the best NLs for me was Canadians from the golden era of BC, i loved the Dr Atomic one ^^ The NLX also, they were free seeds we got with every dutch orders back in the days. The NL x A13 also, she got me a

@FieldEffect

Ortega is a specific blend that I want to grow in particular, if only for fundamentally sentimental reasons.

And i totally get it. It’s exactly the same for me for the Jack Herer and its close cousin the NL5 x Haze.
They are so close that generally people don’t get why i love to have the twos as permanent lines. Just like my POV on the NL ^^ I love to wake&bake with a tailored Jack blunt, insurance of a good day for me. But when i need a treat to chill, it’s the NL5xH that i roll. I like also how they destroy the supposed elite growers i meet in events, and make puke kids and hemp smokers-hipsters within 3 tokes on a blunt ^^

I digress but i appreciate a lot the Blueberry (DJ one). And actually she learned me what is a wounded strain to heal before the time. I’m serious. If i can handle Sensi today, with anger lol, it’s totally because of this specific strain. It’s planned to bring back it in the pool and to try what i’ve failed decades ago : make it stable ^^

As pure I dislike the plant and i dislike the weed, i’m not even liking the breeder and his manners. But i’m fond of its potential, in hybrids it always give stunning chemotypes profiles when you pilot her smartly. The sweet tooth #3 (another love for me) is for me the pinnacle of what can give this fucked line lol

@FieldEffect

f you are annoyed by the drift and uncertainty why wouldn’t you just source different stock to start with?

Nailed. I’m frightened at different levels. I tested varied sources as alternative and ever disliked the signature of those handling it. We just don’t share the same love, i love the complex and rich balance they are and hate these lines when they are shortened asf or only breeded for sweet/casual terps. They lost all their torque that make my morning blunt last a day. No choice, i’ve to sign for a journey in hell with the originals lol

Only one pack of each, mathematically the only thing that can happen is to be forced to cross the twos. I have the hope to maintain them pures, but it’s hopes only that depend totally on the luck considering the actual state of their catalog. Without the garantee to get a decent support if shit happens, it’s random. At the point that i will launch a third line in the same time also, in case of … my stress translate in B and C plans ^^

On money i can handle this, but if the lines are totally fucked at this price … not sure that psychologically i will order again or launch again a blank round. I prefer to deal with it and call it a journey. I push all materials i have to their natural death to don’t miss anything. It mean a very long run with these twos, three digits flo ^^ It’s also why this important round for me is gonna be a one shot time. May Jah be nicer than usual lol

@FieldEffect

I’d expect small preservationists like yourself will be doing a better, more time-consuming job of preserving the line than Sensi is.

It’s when i’m forced to take the hat of the douchebag, but i assume it totally. I was forced to make shit that have non sense for the stupid demands of the popularization/vulgarization. That i resume to transform breeding in hard discount shelves (sold a kidney) and fast food. You know, you fill your belly to the explosion and you’re are very hungry three hours after the meal. This kind ^^ And also : “What do you want in your sandwich ? We have all flavors of the same thing”. I just hate it, and today it’s the rule to survive.

I’ve paid my share too in the pollution of the global genpool, by far ^^ It’s a war against an era I’ve stopped to understand and also against myself. I don’t believe in these things, but call it karmic revenge.

I’m not preserving anything technically then, I’ve just the chance to live a 100% egoist moment i think that i desserve in having working my ass of for it and almost sold my soul at it too. Being free and to don’t give a shit of what i’m saying is just priceless caviar for me, that’s my vision of a perfect situation now.

I think youth and newcomers of today forget totally from where come the genpool ultra-renamed they are hyping like beheaded chickens. They don’t realize that the real weed that make the heart beat always come from us initially. Not from the companies. And that it’s not in imitating them like drones that things will become better, they just accelerate the fallout and make homebreeding more elitist than ever by the exponential difficulty reached each new year. Sad ouroboros that last since a couple of decades now.

For Sensi let’s throw a very personal opinion : they are able and have the firepower to get back in the track. But obviously not without Ben at the commands. He cared about us, really. And it was transformed in good seeds. Don’t get me wrong i don’t take him for mother Theresa at all. But the facts are here, his sons and partners are just business mens compressing costs. They don’t have any fire inside and are at a light year from us.

I’m unable to recreate the Jack Herer like sensi have done it, even in the nicer previous spaces and the best ironed motivation of earth. I just can heal it the max i can. I’m aging too, i’ve no longer the guts and the energy to screen massive arrays during two days straight alone, in keeping them alive lol Also sometimes the experience is a bad ally, you know the hell you will live so you give up before even starting … focusing on your inherent comfort zones. But that’s the story of everybody out there, at one point we specialize as fuck because we stopped the exploration. Simply.

@FieldEffect

Or start over with a NL5 and cross to a Haze from scratch. Is that misguided?

That’s a thing i will push you bluntly to do.

I will more advise you to make your own blend of NLs, then find the pure sativa or the haze that make your heart beat. Then setting a ride with it without listening anyone or the web noise. Just your blunt and you in a bloody match without any pity or hype influence. And test your weed as much as you can, go out in events, share blunts (never with friends, learn to love to beated hard) and stay competitive this way. Aim the moon and never look down. It can end more far that you can even imagine.

@FieldEffect

Certainly you’ll never get identical parents to the original, I get that, but perhaps it’s in the same vein as the NL internal crosses like Black Domina and Ortega being in the same category.

Nailed. If you have the elasticity to deal with it, the plants will reward you X100 at one point. Don’t fight them, listen them.

@funkyfunk

Twenty years for an annual is a lot

A dozen year ago i was back at the cannabis museum. Someone took me for another person and i saw a nursery i was not supposed to see. Je croyais que ça faisait partie de la visite lol, j’y venais pour essayer de vendre une idèe de bouquin. Du coup j’ai vu les ceps de vignes défoncés (l’image est quasi littérale) qui leur servent de pied mères … t’as l’impression de voir sigourney dans alien 4 te suppliant de l’achever au lance flamme. Même un sogger d’amnezia chti sait que s’il veut rester compétitif il doit renouveler ses pieds mères tous les 6 mois max, mais pas la plus grosse seedbank du monde “récemment” ^^

[crownpoodle]

You OK @Fuel ? If this is “chit chat” a real rant would be scary. Sorry… couldn’t help commenting.

[Fuel]

Blame yardgazer and fieldeffect, they produced the right nice spark below the right TNT barrel ^^

[FieldEffect]

So, perhaps unsurprisingly from the discussion, I’m too young to have really known the Sensi catalog, certainly that of old. From what I read, absolutely it sounds like everything got crossed to NL at some point. So absolutely, that is entirely rational your stance on the NL line in general. Adds up, you’ve spent an incredible amount of energy weeding it out of other lines. Sounds like you enjoy NL you just don’t want it blended into everything you smoke.

You want distinct cultivars; not intertwined, watered-down and convoluted “strains.”

@Fuel

And i totally get it. It’s exactly the same for me for the Jack Herer and its close cousin the NL5 x Haze.
They are so close that generally people don’t get why i love to have the twos as permanent lines. Just like my POV on the NL ^^

I gotcha. Props for going for what you want!

@Fuel

I tested varied sources as alternative and ever disliked the signature of those handling it. We just don’t share the same love, i love the complex and rich balance they are and hate these lines when they are shortened asf or only breeded for sweet/casual terps. They lost all their torque that make my morning blunt last a day. No choice, i’ve to sign for a journey in hell with the originals lol

This totally makes sense. Different folks selecting for different things. Different goals, different audiences. You want what you want. Ain’t a thing wrong with that. But that means a difficult dance so to speak.

@Fuel

Also sometimes the experience is a bad ally, you know the hell you will live so you give up before even starting … focusing on your inherent comfort zones. But that’s the story of everybody out there, at one point we specialize as fuck because we stopped the exploration. Simply.

This is applicable to pretty much every facet of life. We have finite time and we have to choose what gets explored with what we have. Truth.

@Fuel

I will more advise you to make your own blend of NLs, then find the pure sativa or the haze that make your heart beat. Then setting a ride with it without listening anyone or the web noise. Just your blunt and you in a bloody match without any pity or hype influence. And test your weed as much as you can, go out in events, share blunts (never with friends, learn to love to beated hard) and stay competitive this way. Aim the moon and never look down. It can end more far that you can even imagine.

This is what the breeder should do. I just grow a little herb here and there, and am just starting to appreciate the art that it is. I mean, I’m a scientist. I love science. But it is an art, surely, dictated by nature and transcribed by us. I intend to find and further the things I like as well. Good advice, and again applicable to any facet of life. Go for it, and got all the way for it. I’m that kind of person.

@Fuel

Je croyais que ça faisait partie de la visite lol, j’y venais pour essayer de vendre une idèe de bouquin. Du coup j’ai vu les ceps de vignes défoncés (l’image est quasi littérale) qui leur servent de pied mères … t’as l’impression de voir sigourney dans alien 4 te suppliant de l’achever au lance flamme. Même un sogger d’amnezia chti sait que s’il veut rester compétitif il doit renouveler ses pieds mères tous les 6 mois max, mais pas la plus grosse seedbank du monde “récemment”

That’s depressing. But the reasons are outlined above - it’s not about a passion for cannabis anymore. It’s about everything else.

@Fuel

I’m unable to recreate the Jack Herer like sensi have done it, even in the nicer previous spaces and the best ironed motivation of earth. I just can heal it the max i can.

Onward! I hope jah blesses you with a path that is easier than you expect. Best of luck on your journey!

It’s fascinating to learn more about this stuff stemming from a simple question about MLI. Also intrigued to learn more about your history, particularly BB. But perhaps we’ve already diverted this thread far enough from simple pictures of new seedpacks

Thanks for the insight and thought-provoking conversation. I enjoy it tremendously.

[Fuel]

Generally when i feel it’s polluting, i send the discussion to the Mithridate’s thread about Vic High theory ^^ He’s cool, he don’t mind.

I don’t think it’s useless here, it’s good to remember to stoners that behind the seeds there a lot of things we are the tendance to forget as a community. Also to prevent on Sensi without saying do/don’t.

If you’re young, my respect just doubled. And you’re fucking accurate in your interpretations. It’s almost disturbing lol, i’m unable to add anything. Trust me it’s a miracle when i’m rocket-launched in these subjects.

Don’t hesitate to shoot me a message on the BB. I can’t share here useful up-to-date infos about it for the moment. Don’t worry, seeds-porn will come back fast. I’m addicted to it personally, it’s the thread i consult the more in OG ^^

[GYOweed]

I smoked their cherry turbo diesel it was delicious

[YescaSmoker]

Anyone getting technical cultivaters ? Alani skunk sounds like something I want but only when it’s on special like right now 50%off orange flavor up the Ying yang

[Sdoyle]

Spanish Moon S1

[Yetigrows]

[JOHN1234]

Thank you Sir!

Grabbed these for $15 (Black Friday sale) and a bunch of other discounted backstock packs.

[Weednerd.Anthony]

Mail call today!!

Thank you so much @Klyphman and @Cbizzle

Your generosity will certainly be returned before long!!

And I also received my last RSSC order…

Now I just have orders I’m waiting on as we speak from GLG, Shoe at headiegardens, Terpy seeds, and KAB farms.

And this is me trying to practice some restraint lol but a few of them were from a little while ago, it just took a bit longer than anticipated for both my payment to arrive, and for my orders to be shipped out, but at this time of year postal delays should very much be expected.

[Klyphman]

Glad they made it, thanks for the heads up!

[Cbizzle]

Awesome man, happy growing!

[Dog]

[Amendment3]

Black Friday. All from 1 pack purchase. Id say not bad. Jaws genetics purchase.