Seedlings with burnt & curled leaves

Most of these popped on Jan 14th and the two with Pink labels “BR” one that is burnt the worst popped on Jan 4th. I used Root Riot Cubes, seedling soil, 20% Happy Frog and 20% perlite. On advise of nute co I added Bio Minerals about 10 days ago and Root Powder 7 days ago, by Dakine420.
At first I had a LED Par 38 bulb but it seemed to burn the BR (Berry Ryder) and others. So I changed to CFL’s, one 28 watt and three 23 watt. The closest bulb is 12 inches away, most are 15ish.

There are 4 differ genetics going at least so some are darker and some are burnt more. I was doing 24hrs light cycle but changed to 20/4 to give them a little rest. The temps are 68 F at the lowest and 85 F at the highest, but avg around 77 F. The RH is a little low, 36-45.

I had one that damped off and stem broke and other never had real leaves, those are the only deaths. I’m truly lost, it looks like either nute burn or light burn. The only nutes are what’s in Happy Frogs, but only put small amount in. For CFL lights most say to run them a few inches away. I can’t run them at 18 inches.?. And I’m running two gentle fans also.

The only others

a odd thing is curlying of the leaves, with the green tag “SH”. I clean all tools, pots and wash my hands before messing with them. At first I used spring water now I’m using Tap water but let it sit for 24 hrs and come up to temp. And it is at 35ppm at the tap…Hopefully the pics will upload ok cuz I’m lost and really need a little help with these little ones. Oh and they do look small to me for being how old they are, I dunno…
Thanks in advance for any suggestions!

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There could be a few things going on here.

I’m not familiar with how much nutes are in the happy frog. But at only 20% it doesn’t sound like much.

If they are a month old, and you’ve never fertilized, now could be the time.

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Soil a little hot for a seedling is my guess. Ime they will pull themselves out of it.

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I agree with @Foreigner they are hungry
Some are showing k def
Some are showing p def
Hit them with some bloom food with higher p and k than n
Don’t rush doing this , wait till they are ready for there next watering and do it then , so you don’t overwater them also : )

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Well that’s what it looks like nute burn or light burn. The only thing about the nute burn is,The 1st and 4th pics are the same plant, which popped on the 4th, the rest on the 14th. If was nute burn or lack of it would not show up as fast as it did, imo. It took about three days for the tops to start browning up.

What about the Root Riot bag, once opened there is condensation inside the bag. It is sealed but you can see moisture in the bag. Some sort of fungus maybe? I have no idea…

I guess anything is possible but with only 20% of Happy Frogs I would doubt it. I see many peps start theirs in HF or FF Ocean, so I dunno.

Do you check pH in the water? IMHO humidity is too low for seedlings, they don’t have enough roots yet … :sunglasses:

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No not yet, just ppm. I guess I should…Yeah RH is on low side, I did put that towel in, brought it up a few. So I will try again. And talk to nute co again and see what they say. And I can always check with breeder too…I’m wondering if the soil is bad? It sat in garage for 3-4 months before I used it. Have a new bag though.

I watered them last night and within 5 mins most leaves were drooping but came back up a few hrs later.
Any idea what that is? Overwater???

You should use this for watering pulverised:

It would be useful also for rising humidity with some moist in the air. You should get a pH measurer too. An incorrect pH makes some nutrients unavailable to the plant even if provided. Take a look at this chart:

That means you won’t correct any deficiency unless you have a balanced pH … :sunglasses:

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Did you inoculate with myco? ( you mention root powder) the wrinkled leaves are from the myco making contact with the roots. It’s fine. ( good actually , shows myco is alive)Usually takes a few days and wears off. If no myco sorry i couldn’t be of help.

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Drooping leaves are normal after watering as long as ( like you say) they don’t stay that way for long. Not sure why. Seen it plenty.

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Don’t use chlorine tap water in organics. (Didnt see chemicals)You’ll piss off your microlife. I hadn’t read this far sorry. Switch back to spring or rain water and add 10 drops cal mag every watering. Chloramine(the new chlorine in drinking water) does not evaporate. Your plants will need food soon but they couldn’t have gone through all of what you had that quick to show deficiency I wouldn’t think. Good luck buddy. Hate sad plants!add mulch😉 my apologies if I presume too much!

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Here are the two products they said to use and it wouldn’t burn it…He said mineral based, not sure if that is a good thing or not in regards to nutes, excuse my ignorance. He suggested to wait on nutes until they were about 8 inches tall. It doesn’t say anything about what’s in them, so I don’t know about Myco’s or not. https://shop.dakine420.com/collections/microbials

I did mix a little Grow and put it on the bag s plant, since the genetics are crap anyways. Also that one is the pale green color, the others are not that pale. I sent him a email with a link here so he could look at the plants. So far they have been really helpful so I’m hoping I don’t have to start over.

It’s been a month now, well almost and they should be larger. And I don’t won’t to lose a months worth of time. I hope it’s not the Root Riot Cubes or something in the soil. The condensation inside the Riot bag has me puzzled…How something wouldn’t grow inside there I’m not sure.?. But thanks for the info! I was hoping to use tap water, but I can at least get a few gallons of water at the store. Would spring or distilled water be better? Thought I read something about distilled water but not sure. Will update tomorrow… @Upstate

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I checked the PH of the Tap and its high at 7.9 and Spring water at 5.6-5.8 It’s only been watered twice with Tap water. @George1961
Going by that chart it could be a Cal Mag issue for soil at 5.6-5.8 range.?.

Even the PH being out doesn’t help much…Cus the first two weeks were Spring water only. The burning tips started within days of new growth of first true leaves.
I read that it sounds like Nitrogen defencency in the “Grow Bible”, if I’m remembering right.?. It starts at the tips and slowly kills the leave, stunts growth and turning yellow. Does that sound right?

Whats the best way to test runoff?
I’ve got to work for a while so it might be a little while before I can reply back. :wink:

I’ll try to get to this after work. But a sure fire way to correct this problem instantly, Is to transplant. Those are really small containers, and they look to be really dry in the photos. I thought your plants were only 2 weeks old? Is that just one of them or two of them? Plants don’t really use any nutrients Beyond what they have in their embryos for the first week of life. 9 more days would get them to use
Up most of the nutes up,but not to the pt. of deficiency. Perhaps the mineral additive messed up the ph? What " root powder" did you use? Spring water should be good unless it has crazy minerals in it. Rain or distilled/ reverse osmosis water is very good but need to add cal mag. Rain is best. It’s alive and has micro amts of nutes. 10 to 20 drops cal mag a watering. Good to start low and increase. I should mention I use only organics . Is that your goal as well? Generally organics are wasted if you use chemicals as well. With Organics the plant chooses what it wants to eat, and when it wants to eat it. With chemicals you tell the plant what it’s going to eat and when.

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Watching those burnt tips makes me think about a slight nutrient burn, plants are too young to give them all those nutes, specially having a prefertilized soil They have a healthy green colour, no brown spots so discard any CalMag issue or N deficiency.

Don’t think flushing or transplanting them is a good idea, too much water and unnecessary stress in this early stage. I would just water them slightly with pHed water (6.2 would be OK) and see how they react, also spray them with some mist as they have little roots and can intake some nutes from the leaves.

I still hear the words of my master Shadey in similar situations I have been: “Don’t panic!” , as long as they are not autos and they are alive there’s nothing to seriously worry about.

I see you’ve got an EC measurer, that water shouldn’t have more than 200 ppm in this stage, even less with that soil, check this out:

Remember is it better to go always in a short feed profile than recovering from a nutrient burn … :sunglasses:

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Well the breeder is saying one thing and nute co is saying another thing, my head is spinning. They popped on Jan14th except for two of them which popped on Jan 4th.

The breeder suggested to replant them in fabric Pots or Air pots. He said it looks like either nute lock out or nute burn and just replant to be safe.

The nute co is saying to use the “Grow” nute at 300ppm and they will snap out of it. Now this is coming from their head grower, but I explained that they have been the same size for weeks now. They are growing but at a very, very slow rate. I didn’t get a clear answer on the cal mag, issue so still a lost on that part.

They are sending me PH up and Down, they only charged me shipping so that was pretty cool of them. The head grower also suggested to use seedling soil only and no Happy Frogs. I’ve only got enough for one or two today and will get more tomorrow.

So it looks like I’m going to have to repot all of them…But that still doesn’t take the Root Riot cube out of the equation, if there was something wrong with them. I’d prob tear the roots up trying to get em out of the cubes so I guess they will stay in. Finally he suggested to feed 300ppm of Grow but I will double check on that and cal mag once repotted.

Man what a pain in the ass! But at least the breeder and nute co are helping out, not all of them will so that’s cool. And of course everyone at OG has been a big help, thx! @Upstate

Problem is they are Autos, lol. I assume that is runoff ppm you are referring to.?. @George1961

It’s the Root Powder and Bio Minerals. The Grow is what they suggested at 300ppm. @Upstate

Holy shit! :sweat_smile: Now you can understand why I don’t like to mess with them :sweat:. Time is running in this case so not much expectations in this grow. Autos are light feeders, I was referring to the water you give them, As I said, they are too young to flush and overwater,and pot size is bigger enough, so I would try to increase humidity, feed them slightly and see how they react.

They say autos are easier for beginners but you have no time to recover if you commit some error. Perhaps you have chosen them to go fast, if you’ve got some photoperiods seeds and room available I would plunge them into water. What light schedule do you have? :sunglasses:

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