Single pistil on a male sour bubble

Hello Folks,

During my gardening today I noticed a single pistil on a male sour bubble current generation. As this is my first time for this to happen i thought i should pose this question, Burn it to hell? Or cherish it with warm embrace?

Ive heard mixed theories over the years, some stating this means its herm and will lead to herm progeny, others such as dj short have claimed that it will lead to fewer males in the progeny and get rid of hermaphrodites.

Im currently undecided as to where my opinion currently sits, If you have experience or some understanding of the topic please chime in.

Together we shall decide the fate of this little green being.

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I always say like begets like. There are so many other males to work with, why use a questionable one?

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I say that you can’t determine from the male alone. If the females are all good, then it’s likely to be ok. If there are any intersex traits in the females, then don’t use it.

I have seen a lot of pistils in jungle spice males, and not ever seen so much as a nanner in probably 20 females grown from seed. This kind of “super female” trait is something I wish to explore. I sometimes wonder if I could use it to straighten out a female herm.

On the other hand, I have also seen it together in lines with female herms. You can’t be certain from only the male. I would say that it only indicates something either exceptionally good or exceptionally bad.

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Do you have a quarantined area to see what it does? Or are you willing to give each calyx you find a hysterectomy? Interesting questions voiced by the others here…
On second thought no hysterectomy required I guess, it being a pollen receiver…
My brain hurts!!!

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My own bro science says that it makes zero difference. You either have Male or female pollen. Pistils can come from stress just like vice versa. Could be high ethylene levels. STS is an ethylene blocker to give you an idea.

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Just to play devil’s advocate, it could also be a female with extremely low ethylene. :smiling_imp:

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I was actually going to bring this up, as I have come across breeders who prefer to use a “pistily” male. Claims seem to be that its due to higher amounts of ethylene, which contribute to a higher chance of female seeds not herming, and producing female offspring seeds, due to the dominating presence of female chromosomes. There is a growing interest in the topic it seems.

Again, this is just something i have only come across, listened in on conversations and read a little on. In theory, it makes sense.

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Well now youre throwing big wrenches into the fans… lol

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Burn it to hell

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Landrace Sativas

i have 3 other males so losing this one is no big loss just didnt want to make a hasty decision, kinda leaning towards killing it

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i have 4 females and as of the moment their all solid females,

this is a pack of current gen sour bubble through the group buy that occurred, If it is indeed bog stock i would hope and expect them to have no intersex traits.

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only have an area to keep this and the other 3 males together, no other setups to move off this lone male

planta are not stressed, even checked ppm and ph levels of the promix and it was all acceptable. Bit cooler than id like but nothing else has shown any issues at the moment.

I mean if you have other males why risk it?

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For me the biggest thrill of growing, is learning. When new things occur I like to take the opportunity to learn from it. With big names like dj short talking about the potential positives associated, then I feel it at least warrants a discussion.

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This male is expressing female intersex traits. I’ve only ever had one male do this and I didn’t even bother. I wouldn’t want to create new seeds with that because think about it like this, XY crossed with XX (these are both pure male and female) you’re going to get pure male and female seeds from that. Now look at it like this even if you had a beautiful pure female XX but now you’ve got yourself a male with female intersex, XYx. A quarter of the seeds you harvest will carry that intersex trait. If you have other nice looking males I would just go with those ones. Keep the hermies at bay the beset you can.

BUUUUUUUT I do see why people would think that it could lead to more female seeds but that intersex gene is still going to be there.

Sorry if I was a little off on my explanation but I hope that made sense.

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Just talked to jd short , dj shorts son, on IG. People are misinterpreting his dad on the more female offspring thing.

"Haha…I have no personal experience on the subject. However maybe the argument isn’t about males that toss pistils or if their offspring are more likely to be female. I think the argument is over whether or not cannabis is dioecious or monoecious. And I think the reason people might be having a difficult time approaching this conversation is because perhaps it’s both depending on regional location and the restrictions placed upon that region. :man_shrugging: clown fish can change their gender depending on what the environment needs. Perhaps cannabis plants can do the same? Maybe plants prohibited by regional restrictions feel the best way to safeguard their future is to be dioecious and perhaps a plant not prohibited by regional restrictions is monoecious. :thinking: "

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X to autosome VS active Y
Here’s an excerpt from a discussion about pistillate “males”.

GMT:
“[…]But to put it overly simplify, x to autosome is where it has one decent X chromosome which does a good job, and a fucked x chromosome. When two fucked chromosomes meet, you get the male flowers flourishing. When a fucked and a good x meet, you get standard flowers which are a bit shitty, and when two good x’s meet you get great female flowers. So the maths give you 75% female and 25% male expression numbers. Of the females you should get 1 in 3 that are representative of the strains potential. So you are searching for the best out of 25% of what you have.
If you swap out the sex chromosomes, while keeping as much of the autosome as possible, with active y mechanisms, then you are searching for the best of 50% of your population. Now you have two good “purpose built” X chromosomes in all of your females. Plus your males are actually male. Meaning you have a Y chromosome to silence the female flower production. So you reduce the number of female offspring, but double the number of decent worthwhile females to search through to find the best.
Plus of course you’re likely to get alternative versions of the other genes in the autosome, generating the healthiest most vigorous plant growth and the greatest range of compounds to be produced possible.”

RO:
“how do you identify the plants with the messed up chromosomes? There are a few strains that express the higher percentage of females, old timers haze, destroyer and Tom hills haze from what I’ve read and didn’t really understand what mechanisms would cause it. All 3 of these lines are supposed to have exceptional prodgany and I’m just wondering if it’s related to what you are saying here about the chromosome selection?”

GMT:
“Lines, from their inheritance and the ratio of m/f. Individual plants, to know for sure, you’d have to test them in a lab. As for specific lines, ask their breeder. I asked tom earlier in the thread about his haze, and he agreed that its likely they are x to autosome rather than active y. There are home order test kits available for identifying male plants. It should be easy enough to test a “male” to see if it has the male genetic marker. If none of them do, you know for sure.”

TH:
"The species is in a constant state of flux eventually landing in dioecy as a sort of genetic fitness move. The X modifier system is more primitive is all, messed up is a bit harsh haha.

Ie it is commonly accepted that all plant species begin with perfect flowers then move along the slow ladder towards dioecy in an effort to survive as deleterious recessives are less likely to be fixed in that scenario."

RO:
“Lol that’s funny cause the plants may have actually stood a chance of achieving it if we weren’t around to mess with it.”

TH:
"Yeah, or, or… the majority of elites are still using the more primitive system.

When pressed my money is on that, until, the line drives itself into the ground."

TH:
“Ie in my experience, the very best outcrossers from thai to haze to shorts blues right on through the chems and og’s - have all been on somewhat shaky ground sexually speaking. I can not fathom other hypothesis than that this has helped them to fix valuable traits.”

BTF:
“Could just be dumb luck”

TH:
“Actually the maths are pretty solid when it comes to fixing traits good or bad monoecy > dioecy.”

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its risky, but genetics are unpredictable. if its a fire male, make the seeds and maybe it won’t pass on the ITS, lots of the best herb throws some nanners.