2nd Grow, Indoor/Outdoor, shooting for 2 harvests this summer

[MrWizard]

Hi Folks,

Just started actually smoking the results of my 1st grow in 40 years! (First grow after a 40 yr break, 1 plant, DWC, LED 450W) My goal is to become self sufficient so I never have to pay for weed again.

I chose to post this in the INDOOR category as Hydro is where I will live the most. However this particular grow is starting indoors in soil, and will be hardened off in a couple weeks and then moved outside.

My tent is in the garage and once ambient temps get above mid 70s I lose control of the environment. Above 80f ambient would not even be worth attempting, the view wouldnt be worth the climb. I would need an AC and a chiller to run in the heat of the summer. I cant make that kind of investment at this time, other $$ priorities.

My second challenge is trying to work out grow cycles so I never run out of weed. I go through about an ounce a month. So figure +/- 3 months to grow , another month+ to cure, I am figuring I need to start with 5oz in my stash when starting a grow or I will run out before the grow is cured. My last plant yielded 3oz cured. I can see the deficit coming…

My solution, at least this year, is to grow my legal limit of 4 plants outdoors, and try to squeeze 2 harvests into this summer by using Autos. That should give me a significant surplus to cover me while I establish a continuous cycle of grows. Come late Fall I can go back into the Tent and grow 2 plants DWC style every 3 months. Hoping that I can then get enough out of the tent that I can skip summer grows. Three DWC grows of 2 plants per grow should yield about 18oz. That would allow me to skip outdoor summer grows, so I can do other things in the summer, like enjoy myself and my last harvest! It would also give me enough surplus to cover me if a harvest completely fails. Hope I dont experience that, but I need to allow for the possibility.

If I am lucky and my surplus exceeds my needs, then I will play with hash. (Yummy)

So, I started 4 zKittlez Autos in the tent about a month ago. My plan is to harden them off and move them outside in about 2 weeks. This is a 70 day strain so chop should occur around mid-late June. I will then immediately plant 4 Mephisto Double Grape Auto S1s (thanks @GCBudz ) which I figured should finish late Sept or early Oct.

I have a lot of questions as I have never grown in soil, or outdoors before. I always did hydro back in the day, and am geared up for DWC now.

• What is the best way to transition/harden plants from LED to Sun?
• Plants are in 3gal fabric pots now, plan to upsize to 7gal pots. How do I minimize the stress of Transplanting and hardening? Should I do both at the same time, or which should come first? They are Autos so I want to minimize recovery time, cant just veg em longer.
• Deer, I have dozens traveling thru, how best to protect the plants?
• Climate is coastal Virginia, high winds, high humidity, and changes on a dime.

So what will follow in this thread is my indoor/outdoor journey.
I am a rookie, albeit technically inclined, any guidance is GREATLY appreciated…

[Foreigner]

I never bother hardening off my plants

When transplanting the best thing to do is make sure they aren’t soaked. It is generally advised not to transplant autos but if you’re careful they shouldn’t miss a beat.

Deer - I dunno.

Soon enough you will have more weed than you can smoke. My 2x4 tent produces a minimum of 8oz and sometimes as much as a pound.

Best of luck

[TopShelfTrees1]

As far as transplanting ensure your soil/medium is exact as in previous pot, already moist and with the same nutes, and leave a perfect hole in the pot the same size, I rarely ever see them phased at all tbh.

[TopShelfTrees1]

Deer you can run a fishing line, line of some sort around the area, when they hit it they will just back off, others use chicken wire painted black for all critters, also there are sprays, powders you can sprinkle around that keep them away or some people buy predator urine and spray it around, scares away EVERYTHING. And hardening is easily done by slowly transitioning via a window/etc. at small amounts each day more and more until ready or using a FL bulb as well, not sure the logic but I’ve seen people do that as well. Best of luck and lots of positive vibes headed your way my friend.

[Foreigner]

I do this:

Soak it and let it dry for a day and then don’t water for awhile.

[TopShelfTrees1]

Exactly like this

[Nagel420]

@MrWizard

What is the best way to transition/harden plants from LED to Sun?

Put them outside when the temps are high enough that no more freezes happen. Lights are pretty bright, most people “harden” off things they’ve grown under much lower light (windowsill?) like veggies. Just tossing out a cannabis plant works for me, no hardening off needed. I DO prefer to have em at least 8-12" tall to keep small rodents from just destroying a tiny sprout.

@MrWizard

Plants are in 3gal fabric pots now, plan to upsize to 7gal pots. How do I minimize the stress of Transplanting and hardening? Should I do both at the same time, or which should come first? They are Autos so I want to minimize recovery time, cant just veg em longer.

Move them to the 7gal pots ASAP. I transplant my autos once, from an 8oz cup to a 3g fabric pot. 7g might be more than they need, I’ve barely had an auto fill out a 5g pot yet with roots. The earlier the better for transplanting autos though.

@MrWizard

Deer, I have dozens traveling thru, how best to protect the plants?

Locate them in brambles, sucks for the deer and us as well, but it works. Also bird netting can deter them as they can’t see it easily, but feel it (its also less visible to passerbys). Human scents dont do diddly for me (hair, soap, etc) as they are in close proximity to humans all the time, they’ve become nose blind or immune to it. Deer-Off spray has worked on my lilys and hostas here (thats deer crack for those not in the know). Might use that on vegging plants, but not sure I would wanna spray it after flowering has started (its made of capsaicin and putrescent egg solids). I have to spray the hostas / lilys monthly (weekly in the beginning of the season when the pack on major growth). If they are in the yard (and VA is legal, right?) get a water scarecrow. I’ve used them for ponds to keep herons away. Hook up to your hose, and are motion activated. Just turn off the hose before you tend the girls.

@MrWizard

Climate is coastal Virginia, high winds, high humidity, and changes on a dime.

Humidity scares me with some autos. I had some outside last summer, and they were awesome till August hit with rains and high humidity. That brought bud rot and destroyed the autos. (photos werent budding enough yet and were fine in October). This year my strategy for autos is get em outside and CUT by the end of July, figuring on a 3-4 month growth cycle on avg. (Before the humidity and rains of august come) For winds, just stake them up… Tomato cages work well also

[MrWizard]

@Nagel420

I transplant my autos once, from an 8oz cup to a 3g fabric pot.

So… would I be ok just leaving them in the 3 gal pots? It sounds like maybe I am overdoing it with a 7g. It would reduce one more potential stress event.

[Nagel420]

In my experience with the strains I have run, 3g work fine for most autos. There’s a few bigger ones being bred now, I have a pair of GG4 autos from Corey that are definitely bigger than the others, residing in 3g pots and when I chop them will be checking the root structure.

I have some of those double grapes as well, and they will likely be going outside also. So I’ll be starting the seeds shortly, anticipating getting them outside by the end of April.

Word to the wise, when they say 70 day strains, take that with a grain of salt. I’ve had plenty go longer than the breeders recommendation. I’ve also noticed temp CAN affect duration. Grew my first set of Black Cream autos last summer inside, and temps were mid 70s - mid 80s, finished in 10.5 weeks - 11 weeks. Grew my second set of Black Cream autos this fall > winter, and avg temp dropped nearly 10 degrees, to 65-75. That added a solid 2 - 2.5 weeks to their finish time. Finish for me is between 20-30% amber. Was interesting to note the added time for the 10 degree temp drop, across the board with all the autos. Warmer raises metabolism? I dunno, but I did notice the difference.

For the autos in the 3g, I’d run them as is myself. If ya wanna try out the 7g, on your second batch why not get em started in cups / transplant right to the 7, and see? If the rootball is barely filling a 3, maybe try a 5. If its not filling the three, I’d stick with the three. 1’s and 2’s I HATE with a passion, way too much work required. There is benefit to more soil no doubt… But not so much that moving the plant becomes unmanageable.

My autos are started in Johnny’s worm casting method till they have a 1" tap, then moved to solo cups. Clear / semi opaque lets you see the roots, and I transplant out of cups before the roots start to encircle the bottom. You could even do a clear solo cup nested in a red if you were worried about light. Just melt drainage holes. They go from the cups to their final pot then (3g here). I wanna try putting some in the ground this year as well, so we’ll see how that goes… Have plenty of fem BC seeds to play Johnny Potseed and just broadcast some in a corner of the garden Experimenting is fun!

[MrWizard]

Wow, great explanation. Thank you!

I am kind of liking the idea of not having to transplant, at least not for the zKittelz. I think (hope) the Double Grape might be a larger girl so I will start with 7g on those.

I have been just germinating in a small rockwool cube in a bowl. When the roots start coming out the bottom of the rockwool I stick the whole cube in the dirt and leave it. Not saying this is right/wrong, just what I sort of landed on because it works so well for hydro.

[MrWizard]

zKittelz Auto - Barneys Farm
Gender Feminised
Genes 50% Indica / 50% Sativa
Genetics Zkittlez x OG Kush x Auto
Harvest 600 g/m²
Flowering 70 - 77 days
THC 23.0%
CBD 0.9%
Sewn 3/5/22
Sprouted 3/8/22

Plants were 28days old yesterday when I took the pic.

#1 = An example of whorled phyllotaxy, has 3 leaves at every node. 2 pistols showed on it yesterday.
#2 = Was the tallest of the lot, but had minimal growth at nodes, just fan leaves.
#3 = The runt of the bunch, all 4 were popped at same time.
#4 = To me, this one looks perfect, short internode spacing, good growth at nodes, larger fan leaves.

I attempted a “FIM” on #1 and #2 two days ago.
Dont plan on training #3 or #4 at all.

[NorthNorthNugs]

Looks like others have covered your questions quite well. I’m also learning myself but this will be my 3rd season outdoors this year and have learned a few things along the way that’ll I’ll share. I’m still trying to perfect the transition of my autos from indoors to out and am planning on writing a post today to get some advice so maybe keep an eye out for it.

Either way;

• For my transition to outdoor, in the past I started my auto seeds 4 weeks to the day that I plan on taking them outside and veg them in a tent for all that time in a 1 gal pot. This has worked out pretty well for me, most of the time. Typically I sprout in a jiffy pellet then transfer to a 1 gal then outside in a 5 gal. I let them chill outside in a half shaded area, like under some leaves where the sun is just breaking through then if it’s going to be chilly that night they sleep inside. I honestly have no idea if this helps or not but that’s just what I’ve done and haven’t seen any issues. Then on day two it’s full sun and potted up to the 5 gal. I’ve ran autos more than a handful of times in the 7 gal outside and honestly it’s very unnecessary in my opinion unless you are a seasoned auto grower and know how to maximize a strains potential. I’ve done a 5 gal side by side with a 7 gal and the plants in the 5 gal got bigger last summer… probably just had something to do with genetics but that was the deal breaker for me.

• For deer, as others have mentioned fishing line around your grow at chest level and foot level. Typically if they feel a bit of resistance they will back off from moving towards your plants. That is just something I’ve read though so take that with a grain of salt.

• For high winds, a tomato cage is fine but what I like to do is steak in 4 bamboo poles. I lay them out like a compass. One on each of the 4 coordinates; N, S, E, W. Try to actually steak them in at exactly those coordinates to where you are and put them in the soil at a bit of an angle so that the poles look like the letter Y when you squat down, spreading outwards at the top. Now once the plants starts to stretch in week 4-5-6 you tie down the stem a few inches from the very bottom to the south pole and the very top to the north pole so the plant is sitting like the letter S. This method opens the plant up to the path of the sun moving from East to West and in my experience helps to grow the lower nodes. This is just a low stress training technique I learned from a book somewhere and seems to work very well for me. You will need to move the upper tie at the top of the plant as it grows.

Here are some pic examples of what I did last summer.

You can see how early I start the LST (low stress training) and how it helps the lower nodes grow, increasing yields.

Here’s an example of my 5 gal pot in the front totally crush my 7 gal pots in the back…

Anyway I did a complete outdoor grow thread last summer if you want to check it out.

[MrWizard]

Still not sure how my “fim” attempt i s going to work.

This is the whorled phyllotaxy:

This was the tall skinny one:

The Whorlly-Bird is going to interesting I think. It was the 2nd tallest at 2 weeks, has already threw out pistils, and it started stretching when I "fim"d it.

[MrWizard]

Its WhorllyBird by a nose…
She is throwing out pistils like crazy, no sign of flowering on the other 3 yet.

[MrWizard]

Ist time I have tried FIMing.
Not sure yet if it is better than topping. Looks like “maybe” I got an extra cola or two. Wont know until the colas grow out a bit.

[MrWizard]

Whorlly is stretching, pistols everywhere, but the flowers all look larfy. I hope they fatten up but right now they look punny.

Funny how different each of the 4 plants are, all from the same pack. Guess this is starting to teach me about phenos.

Conditions are almost to the point where I will have no choice but to move them from the tent to outdoors soon. Ambient in the garage is alternating between hot and humid, sometimes both. I am almost at the point of losing control of the environment. Am hoping to last 1 more week to get past local last frost averages.

[Foreigner]

@MrWizard

. I am almost at the point of losing control of the environment.

How bad are we talking?

[MrWizard]

VPD climbing to 1.3 and above, beginning of flower stage…

Temp and humidity both too high. My wife commandeered the dehumidifier so I cant compensate there, and no AC in the garage.

[Gpaw]

Beginning of flower is reasonably forgiving but you need to address that issue within a couple weeks. Internal air circulation will help as well.

Cheers
G

[MrWizard]

The rain stopped finally. Was able to get the VPD down to 1.0 with the LEDs on.

I am running the night cycle from 11am to 7pm to reduce the heat I put in during the heat of the day.

I think I will make it.